D!

Your scooter spewing oil everywhere yet? Get you a billet basket machined from 6/4. I'll donate the parent mat'l.

Page 3, bitchez.

* Last updated by: hagrid on 12/7/2016 @ 3:23 PM *

The verdict at 1441r.com was don't bother with the high pressure oil pump gear or the high pressure relief valve. Peak stock pressure is well over 100psi as it is. If it doesn't spew oil stock, a simple plate won't do it.

I am seriously thinking about going with an oil pressure gauge though. Oil temp, NOS pressure and fuel pressure too. White faces/blue numbers to match my speed and tach with illuma-glo gauge faces. Should look cool.
quik mock up. probably put a couple small digital gauges in there someday, too.

As for the billet basket, the hub and basket are both aluminum already. Not much to save weight on there....unless you cut some holes...LOL basket already has lightening holes all along the outer wall.

I got my EBC Clutch Hub Tool a few days ago. Looks good. About 1/8" thick and has some kind of gold finish on all edges. I'm hoping that is a special plating to help decrease the chances of scratching. I think the cutting of the EBC logo in the handle was dumb. It looks cool but that weakens the handle considerably. Also the way the handle forks into 2 before connecting to the ring...that's necessary to fit between the fingers on the basket. Each fork goes between fingers.

It seems to fit well. I was able to find a position it would slide into but if you want the handle at a particular angle, you may need to turn the hub. The orientation between the hub teeth and the basket fingers changes all the time so I guess there is no guarantee both will line up with the tool after the motor is shut down. I got lucky I guess. It slid in smoothly after I tried several positions. (hagrid?)

I'll post a full review after I use it. You could stack 3 of these tools together to reduce the chance of gouging the hub teeth by 75% [edit 01-2017--only two will fit]. I'm ordering 2 more before I start reefing on the breaker bar.

* Last updated by: Rook on 1/3/2017 @ 12:37 PM *

I probably should add some shims or stiffer springs before doing any serious racing next year, might as well replace the bolts and nuts with titanium and upgrde the oil pump plate at the same time, right?

Cool, if you are running NA, your stock clutch will hold all the hp your engine can make. Romans uses Brocks springs and shims on his 300+ hp bikes. I have this funny little feeling all springs are pretty much the same tension as OEM. Brock reports that his springs without any shims equal OEM tension. Each Brock shim you put in = 7 lbs (approximate guess) of additional pressure. I got Adams springs because of this thread. I plan to be doing an 80 shot of NOS though.

http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=27&TID=68156

The Adams springs are probably no stiffer than OEM but the spacers are like a half inch deep aluminum tubing. Drawback is you cant stack them up to the height you want like Brocks. If you don't want all that tension, you have only one big shim to remove and them you're back close to OEM, I presume. If you are super careful to make the top and bottoms true, You could probably make your own shims out of aluminum pipe and keep the stock springs.

The spring bolts are about 3" long so they would cost a bundle in Ti. You have washers too.

Answers I got on this thread lead me to belive the stock oil pump is more than up to the task. The guy said his oil pressure gauge only goes to 100 psi and he sees the needle go way past the 100 mark all the time.

http://zx1441r.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=3587&p=32742#p32742

Other oil pressure mods are a shimmed or aftermarket oil pressure relief valve and a high output oil pump gear. Both put more stress on the oil pump, eat a couple ponies through parasitic drag and really are not necessary. Romans does not even use them on his turbo bikes.

Everyone agrees the billet oil pump cover is the only oil pump mod that is necessary and even that, I doubt is necessary. It's only 60$ though. might weigh an ounce or so more than the OEM steel one, I have not weighed yet. I don't see how a 3 inch by 1/8 steel plate bolted down at the edges flexes all that much but since everyones doing it, I thought I might as well for $60.

I'm installing the oil pump plate, springs and putting on an oil pressure gauge. I may remove the oil cooler at some point. I doubt that would increase pressure but it is unnecessary weight.

I had read that in the top of sixth some bikes had a little clutch slip close to top speed (hope to push 210hp, and 200mph)? Brocks mod also eliminates the slipper function which supposedly makes it easier to launch?
Reading up on Shane's build, with the mods and power he was making, with an experienced LSR rider (Rachel) that weighed around 160# they barely got over 200, 203 if I remember correctly, and that was with really light tires, carbon wheels, and the front end strapped down. In order to get my ass at around 220# I've got to make more hp, and be more efficient if I'm going to get close to 200 in a mile.

This is why I think I'll need a cut tank, aero front fender, and maybe a custom aerodynamic tail to try to reach my goal.

The oil pump plate seems like it could be a worthwhile insurance item, since I might be in there anyway to do the shims/springs and swapping out the little parts with titanium/aluminum. I'm still thinking about taking out the balancers while I'm in there, should free up a little more power/reduce a little weight..

Didn't realize how much work is involved with the balancers. Maybe next year when we get the ceramic transmission bearings done? :\

* Last updated by: CoolBrzBlu on 1/27/2017 @ 2:06 AM *

Go with the HD springs then. Can't hurt but it might be harder to pull the clutch lever. I heard one Brocks shim made no real dif in clutch feel on a zx-10.

From Brocks clutch mod install video, I gather slipper clutch allows some play when the clutch is engaged.

Anything tricky about the nut or bolts involved, or will standard shapes work?

The clutch plates are not difficult to remove but they will turn the clutch counterclockwise. You must put the bike in gear and have the rear suspension loaded and that will hold the clutch steady. The clutch spring bolts are not tight but if the clutch turns counterclockwise, the rear wheel will turn clockwise if the transmission is in gear. I was worried about the bike pulling ahead and off its side stand so I put it up on a rear stand and and put a book under the rear wheel. Then I lifted the front on a front stand so the tire rested tightly against the book. NOT TOO THICK OF A BOOK--suspension only collapses about and inch. Too thick of a book and the spools would lift out of the stand and the bike falls. If you have someone to hold the bike, you will probably be fine just removing the spring bolts with the bike on the side stand and in gear. 6th gear will be best so shut down in 6th and coast into the garage. Then you need to start up in 6th because I do not believe you will be able to get the gearbox to shift until started. Again, if you have a person to hold the bike, 2nd or even 1st would be fine but you are giving a machanical advantage to the transmission and the rear wheel will turn with less torque than it would in 6th.

The rest is easy.

If you are planning to go with the oil pump plate and/or other mods in there, the plates, hub and basket need to come out. It's a process of carefully marking everything so all goes back in the same order and the hub and basket can be aligned as they were when you disassembled. There could be errors if you are in a hurry but all that really seems to be imperative is that the clutch plates go back in front to back exactly as they came out. The steels seem to have a definite inner face and outer face but that is easy to identify. Other than that, I don't think it matters too much if a fiber is put in with the outer face now turned in or if the tongues on the fibers do not ride in the same fingers in the basket or the teeth of the steels are not in the same teeth on the hub as they were when disassembled...or if the hub turns inside the basket. All that stuff is turning and changing in there when you ride the bike. I'm a perfectionist though so I am putting it all back exactly as it came out.

The clutch hub nut will want to turn he clutch when you remove it just like the spring bolts did. That is what the tool a few posts above is for. I have not removed the hub nut yet but it will be 10x tighter than the spring bolts.

If you use an impact and follow Brock's video, you should have no problem with stuff turning while you are removing bolts. I didn't want to use an air impact blowing dirt all up in the air. I'll be trying a breaker bar.

I'll be posting tutorials on all of this in the next month or two.

* Last updated by: Rook on 12/27/2016 @ 7:38 PM *

Thanks for the tips. Is the clutch nut and the spring bolts standard shapes, or do I need custom titanium parts?

The springbolts are unusual in that they are pretty long but I'm sure the thread must be one of the typical pitches for whatever mm it is. I used an ordinary 10mm socket to remove them. Each spring bolt has a washer that you may have difficulty finding in Ti. There is not a lot of torque on the springs. You could probably make aluminum washers for the spring bolts. I wonder if they make Ti springs?

I have not removed the clutch hub nut yet. Probably tomorrow, weather permitting. Far as I know, it's an ordinary nut but possibly a HD alloy since it is meant to be torqued about 100 ft lbs. There is also a couple washers under the hub nut. One of them has a special angled surface. You would have to have one machined in Ti.

There is a washer on the end of the throwout bearing too. You could make on in Ti if you want.

....and I think you have some extra washer for the slipper clutch on your Gen2. Saw that in Brocks video a few posts back.

Actually, that hub nut has a short section on top to extend the threads and a beveled top. You won't get that in Ti unless you make it like you did with your sprocket nut.

Had a go at it today and I almost popped a nut but it wasn't the one on the bike. Need a 3 foot length of pipe on my 24" breaker bar.

Cool, if you plan to go Ti on that I'd say that nut is a one timer or two timer at most. Probably would be wise to replace it if it's that hard coming off. My 30mm axle socket feels a little sloppy on it. 29mm is too small to fit.

Thanks for the pics. Might have to order one of those bolts in order to get a Ti part made. At least the nut looks normal..

Little Christmas present to me...I bought those GlowShift Gauges pictured a few posts above!!! No way they will mount the way I have it mocked up in the pic but I got some plans and you better believe they are cool plans! Can't wait. Still lots of time for wrenching. Heck, it hasn't even gotten cold yet.

Merry Xmas. That's a serious set of gauges. Getting ready to add some boost?

Haha-- I'm going N2O on the 14! This is probably more than half for the bling factor but I do actually look at the LCD-200 gauges. These will be more easy to read on the fly. Planning a couple digital gauges in the future as well. Digital is really the way to go if you need to log data from the sensor that goes to the gauge, Don't have as much of a need to log oil pressure, oil temp or AFR (already logs AFR through the PC5). Nos pressure is probably something i can keep track of without logging too.

Finally got that hub nut off after two prior attempts. I did not need to put a pipe on the breaker bar but I did need to brace my knee against the rear stand and press backward on the fuel tank while I pulled on the bar.

There is another odity about the hub nut. It has a flattened spot stamped on the outer reduced portion. I believe this is how the nut is supposed to be so that it self locks. There's another thing your machinist might wish to adress, Cool. I don't think it is necessary. The rotation of the hub should tend to tighten the hub nut if anything.

Interesting pic. Might just order a set of stock parts and have them copied, unless anyone has some used pieces sitting around? :/

$9.86 + shipping from bikebandit. If I don't reuse mine, I'd be glad to send it to you.

That's an elliptical nut.Same as on the sprocket.Supposed to replace everytime it's removed.No way.I've replaced mine twice.Out of several sprocket changes up front.

Thank you Greenie. Guy at zx1441r.com says these are pretty common in automotive engineering. Yeah, if the points do not look gouged, I'll probably reuse it one more time. I don't recall the sprocket nut having a crushed in side. I reused that one too. Will replace soon when I redo my sprockets.

* Last updated by: Rook on 1/5/2017 @ 5:40 PM *

Ordered some stock used parts to have titanium parts made out of. The Gen 2 spring perch bolts are a totally different setup, and we have six springs and perches.
I've seen aluminum clutch packs for other bikes, not sure how well that would work with our torque levels. I wonder how long they would last if the bike wasn't drag raced? I'm really only planning on standing mile and roll racing anyway..

I've seen aluminum clutch packs for other bikes, not sure how well that would work with our torque levels. I wonder how long they would last if the bike wasn't drag raced? I'm really only planning on standing mile and roll racing anyway..

i think the problem would be where the plates engaged to the basket and hub but I don't see why it wouldn't work if you checked the plates often enough.