Ok, here is the question of all questions. Does the 4 into 2 give you the best low end Torque and Horsepower? Sport bikes generally have 4 into 1 with high reving motors. Sport tourers like the FJ1300 have 4 into 2. If this is the case, then why is the ZX14 running a 4 into 2 and the Concours 14 running a 4 into 1? Which one is better for low to mid power?

Midrange rideability definitely a 4 into 2. I have a 4 into 1 and top end ok, but less midrange.

I don't have much practical experience here but I asked tons of questions over and over and viewed a lot of dyno charts. Slipons/ full system/ stock exhaust/ duals/ single????? My main concern was exactly what you are asking about -- low end power vs peak power. This was important to me because above all else, I wanted to improve performance.

I went from stock exhaust to full system. I was tempted to go with slipons because:
1. The anecdotal low end loss with a full system.
--------There is no low end loss with my full system that has any impact on how i ride on the street. If there is any loss, it is in the first 1K rpm right off idle, while I am releasing the clutch. I can't say for certain that there even is a dip in power. I think the dif might be that i can hear the bike take off now where it was so quiet before. I do not need to ride at higher rpm to maintain streetable power at all. I can still prowl at 2K if I want.

2. Duals look very good.
--------They certainly do. The 4-2-1 has its own aesthetic also. The sprocket side of the 14 does look a bit blank now. Brocks makes a superb full system for the 14 that comes in duals.

3. Slipons are cheaper.
----Look at the prices and compare. The price of slipons is not that much less than a full system. I couldn't see spending money on slipons just to turn around and buy a full system later on.

4. full system is more work to install.
It is.....but a great way to get to know the bike better.

5. Full systems require tuning.
I guess they do but almost everyone uses at least a base map no matter whether they run slipons or a full system. It is no big deal. I had the PC on there for months and enjoyed a Stock map before I switched to the 4-2-1. I run a map for my full system and i don't feel that it requires a custom tune.

Here is the way i see the change to a good free-flowing aftermarket system: The engine may benefit from back pressure at low rpm (maybe just a little). After the motor gets turning, back pressure is in direct opposition to acceleration. I used to describe the 14 as feeling like there was some kind of mysterious, explosive power humming in there over 3K rpm. It was a little scary to feel all that power inside the bike and certainly, to see the great speed and acelleration it could produce. After going to the 4-2-1, I now know the the feeling that the engine power could fling the bike apart was the restriction of the stock system. It feels totally free to fly -- it lets all the power out and it is 2x as scary now....but good scary. My busa with the stock system feels absolutely atrocious now. It is boaring as hell.

The 4-2-1 seems to run cooler but this is not a good time of year in Northern Wisconsin to make that call. The muffler does not get nearly as hot and it cools of in 2 minutes. In addition, you can maximize the weight loss with a 4-2-1. The weight loss has such a large impact on handling that IMO, i would go full system for that reason alone.

The only downside to the full system is that it pops on decel. When I first installed, the popping happened really bad after the motor warmed up. I have reduced that ~35% with a PAIR block off and running high octane gas. The Popping is now not much issue when riding at normal street rpm. Tuning may improve it more. Incidentally, people who run slipons also mention that they get some popping. I imagine duals are better in this regard because the unspent fuel is distributed between two pipes.

One more thing, A full system has fatter pipes so your ground clearance will reduced under the bike a little bit. Just watch the wheelie descent.

I like my Cannon. Great power throughout the range, nice price. Buy yourself some earplugs though -- it is LOUD!

Does the 4 into 2 give you the best low end Torque and Horsepower?

Looking at dyno graphs, you can see that 4-2-1 systems are superior to stock systems all across the range. The only thing that you can't see is what happens below 3K because that never registers on a dyno. My seat of pants dyno tells me the Cannon is better even below 3K. Just that first 1/2 second on a take off from idle -- maybe ??? Have not heard many people running full systems tell me otherwise.

If this is the case, then why is the ZX14 running a 4 into 2 and the Concours 14 running a 4 into 1? Which one is better for low to mid power?

* Last updated by: Rook on 11/23/2009 @ 9:32 AM *

Midrange rideability definitely a 4 into 2. I have a 4 into 1 and top end ok, but less midrange.

I went from stock to Muzzy slip-ons, then to a full system in a very short period of time. What I have lost is Time and some money during the learning curve. I now have MORE power from ground up, of this I'm sure. I too must admit, the look of Brocks full dual system looks SWEET.

From what I have read somewhere in the past the 14 came with the duel exhaust to meet EPA (I think thats the governmental agency) noise requirements. The problem with the 4-2-1 stock system was that the muffler would of been huge in order to meet the exhaust noise requirements.

I first had M4's then D&D's. They both did a great job reference power and torque.

I now have built a custom 4-2-1 system which I love. I took a Boz Bros Moira cut the final section off. Installed a Krome Works drag pipe baffle. Then had the final section re-welded back on.

When I first put the "stock" Moira pipe on it was 100 times louder than hell and I had absolutely no back pressure which resulted in no bottom end torque. After installing the drag pipe baffle I regained all of my lost bottom end torque with the huge weight advantage in that I lost both stock cans. I bet the bike is under or damn close to to 500 pounds.

An added benifit is that the exhaust is hospitable but if I get on it it screams like a banshee. Sounds like an indy car.

AZ14, lets see some pics of this pipe.

I went to great lengths to get "performance" form my Muzzy slip on system. I ended up removing the cat from the collector. I have no absence of low end power without that backpressure. But I do have trouble with the bike misbehaving in parking lots and school zones. It gets grumpy when I make it go that slow. It's only happy when I'm feeding it more gas!
It seems to me that all my high performance vehicles, over the years, have had problems at idle. I live with it as a fact of life. But I guess it doesn't have to be. Technology has done a lot to give us best of both worlds. Kawasaki was very deliberate about making the 14 have what they call good street manners. That was the purpose of the delayed opening secondaries and fuel shut off functions. They were afraid of having riderless bikes streaking through parking lots.
Everything involves a tradeoff. To get something you have to give something. Look for the compromise that suits you best. I can live with 1K grumbling cause I'm used to it. Of course I have no problem watching black and white TV shows, either, because that's how I was raised.

* Last updated by: Sharkey on 11/27/2009 @ 11:27 AM *

I have the street meg,lots of map support, I find different maps give power in different areas.Some maps feel slower because the hit over 6k doesn't feel so hard because she is more responsive at lower RPM due to a smoother curve.If you ever listen to a loud car audio system the bass impact can be very impressive now balance it out with mids and highs and it doesnt seem that loud any more.Think of bass as peak HP ,mids as mid range HP and highs as low end HP.I would have to say a power commander is like a spectrum analizer wish I could use it as well as I can EQ car audio.The biggest draw back on a full system is you lose the go quickly quietly mode.

The biggest draw back on a full system is you lose the go quickly quietly mode.

Roman. I'm in California for the Thanksgiving holiday. Will post pics after I get back home.

Will post pics after I get back home.

Thanks for the input guys.

I gained power from 3k on up going from a stock to full 4 to 1. As mentioned above dyno dont show below 3k. The bike lost 30lbs so handles much better and runs a lot cooler. I got better gas mileage also. It is also not much louder than stock.
Dyno tuned on a mustang dyno - before and after.

* Last updated by: hoopie on 12/5/2009 @ 2:32 PM *

Anyone try the Muzzy system? Muzzy focuses on Kawi's, so you would think they would make a great system for the ZX14.

I use to have the Muzzy Slip-ons. Loved the sound. The two guys I ride with both have Muzzy full systems. M-14 and the M-10. I must tell you this, IMO, the M-10 is the best sounding pipe I have ever heard up in the higher RPM. WOW.

Here one for u to look at

* Last updated by: bgordon on 1/18/2010 @ 6:38 AM *

Is there anybody here with the Brocks CT SERIES™ DUAL CANISTER FULL TITANIUM system?

I've seen commercial video on youtube and the looks are great, but how's the finish....

* Last updated by: voodoodoo on 1/18/2010 @ 3:44 PM *

When you have a 4-2 system is there a big difference in whee u have power? Is it worth it compared to the 4-2-1?

voodoo i have the ct duals and love em. and the whole system weighs just 8.25 lbs

* Last updated by: scottjkyl on 2/2/2012 @ 1:56 PM *

I've seen commercial video on youtube and the looks are great, but how's the finish

When you have a 4-2 system is there a big difference in whee u have power? Is it worth it compared to the 4-2-1?