Hey guys, So I am trying to figure out if there is a difference between HMs flagship quickshifter and the one just below it. I currently am in the process of getting back a new Plus SS Lever for my ‘12 14r. I was initially told by one of HMs US Dealers that the GP quickshifter only is referring to SHIFT PATTERN! ... I’ve also been in contact with HM and are still left confused. They also refer to it as a “type of shifting” so to me that means that the SS Is the same or has same capabilities?

Not sure of what you are asking but...GP refers to the shift pattern. Stock is 1 down , 5 up..By altering the linkage arrangement, the patten is reversed to 1 up, 5 down.

* Last updated by: chrly on 3/21/2019 @ 12:20 PM *

@chrly I get all that. HMs flagship Quickshifter is the called "The GP Shifter". I've since talked to them but what I was trying to figure is, is this only referring to shift pattern or is this Technologically advanced further than the rest of the product line. This is what HM told me today:

"The SS part of the Plus SS is from the HM GP shifter.

The GP shifter is designed for race teams in mind.
It comes with a program to set up all sorts of information when connected to various sensors.
We do not offer the connections for your model bike so the only real features of the jnit you would be able to use would be setting different kill times for different gears. Which the Plus SS will also do."

Makes sense but I dont know about the Plus SS having capabilities of adjusting EACH gear?HMMMMH!

The HM GP surely does not refer to shift pattern, it stands for Grand Prix as Moto GP. All HM shifters are capable of either GP or standard shift pattern. You just set the strain gauge for compression or extension and it will cut ignition accordingly.

If you have not already, go to this page and click on PRODUCT SPECS to select Plus SS or GP.

http://hmquickshifter.com/product-category/products/hm-quickshifters/

*The GP is capable of clutches downshifts, the Plus SS can only kill for upshifts and has no auto blip capability for clutches downshifting.

*The GP has separate kill times/gear as well as upshifting/downshifting.

* The GP has the Seamless Shift tech which detects when the gear has actually been engaged thus avoiding missed shifts. The HM Plus SS also has the SS feature so I would think that is almost as good as also having the capability to chose kill time/gear. Missing shifts sucks really bad so I would pay more for the added insurance of kill time/gear even with Seamless Shift. Can't say I have ever tried either but know for sure I don't want my gear box banging back down at 10000 rpm. You get chips of gear dog in your next oil change as a consolation prize.

*The GP has programmable minimum and max kill times incase the the SS feature has a snafu. Sounds like SS might not be 100% reliable maybe?? --so the GP has min/max killtime as backup??

* The GP has data logging. I guess that's cool but not of much use unless it has a good assortment of parameters to read. If it's just what gear you were in and when that is not very useful. Gear, rpm, actual killtime with SS,etc, I think I would use that to help me program the shifter.

* The GP has a couple features under development. I recall reading this back in 2013 so I don't know when or if they will ever get around to completing those.

I think you have a great shifter in the HM Plus with SS. Wish I had that instead of my ordinary HM Plus. The HM GP is apparently a much more advanced shifter than either. I'd pay more for it because I love to use a quick shifter so much. I want to be able to use it with 100% confidence and if the HM do can't do that, nothing can. I'd get an air shifter or electric. That never misses and is probably more inline with what the 14 was designed for. I like road racing style sport riding and I also enjoy shifting by foot so I went with the HM. Cost me about $700 but I'd pay 1200 or so for an HM GP. I love it that much.

* Last updated by: Rook on 3/21/2019 @ 6:05 PM *

@Rook indeed! The 3 main things I was looking for with HM as a whole:
1) Adjustable Kill Times
2) Ability to downshift
3) Adaptive Quickshifter Aid system (HMSS)

As you stated I believe the electronic sensor/Hmss system is automatically adjusting kill times electronically.
Only thing that kind of bugs me is the inability to downshift. It's not the biggest issue but kinda sucks. Might go with the ProShift DBS Downshifting module later. That thing definitely caught my eye!

* Last updated by: 14isKing on 3/21/2019 @ 6:33 PM *

So sounds like you are leaning toward getting the HM GP then? The only one that can downshift but requires some kind of relay from some other manufacturer.

As far as the HMSS, yeah that sounds like the shifter detects when the bike has actually locked into gear before it will resume ignition. IDK how it does it. Does it tap into the gear position sensor?? I don't know if you have noticed but the gear position display on the multifunction meter has some latency. That could be why The HM GP has adjustable min/max killtime. If you have a slow gear position sensor, the max killtime will override it. If that's the case, it might be too slow to be effective for me. I obviously clutch shift faster than my gear pos sensor identifies the gear if I see the number change after I have shifted. I'm not sure this happens in every gear or all of the time but I have definitely observed it. In any case, the min/max killtime feature should keep you safe if the SS feature and killtime/gear are not. It will just be slow if the indicated gear position changes slow. ---seems like that could not be the case if pro riders are relying on this to increase lap times.

I would ask how the HMSS detects that the gear change has physically happened. They say an algorithm?

I think that RPM may be the biggest factor in killtime adjustment and that IS a part of the HMSS algorithm along with engine load and rider actions (how hard you push the shift lever, I presume). It seems the HMSS gathers a few sources of data. Seems better than just the gear position sensor data and also sounds like it learns as you ride from the description.

* Last updated by: Rook on 3/22/2019 @ 11:41 AM *

As far as clutches autoblip downshifts, that would be extremely cool but probably more effective for bikes with slipper clutches. Does the 14R have a slipper? I enjoy blipping myself and downshifting with the clutch so I can release the clutch lever like a slipper. You could still do that with auto blip if you want---unless you already have an automatic slipper clutch. To me, the throttle and clutch both come into play in hard engine braking so auto blip is kind of a mute point. Also, gear shift speed is less important in downshifting. I'd like to have that auto blip anyway though.

I'm really tempted to offer to buy the HM GP off you if you don't like it. Not full price but close. I'd get a quote for one from HM myself and just buy yours for maybe 15% less? That is assuming it was A) in my price range and B) used for a short time, all the threads and connectors were intact and the electronics worked as they should which I'd have to install and test before paying up. I'd pay shipping to and if necessary, from. Put up a thread to see if you can trust me. The others will vouch for me but I'd have to verify everything works.

@ Rook yes I was told by the HM rep, HMSS uses a algorithm to figure out determine the kill times appropriately with your initial setting. I dont have the Plus SS Lever yet. They just finished the new batch and will ship my Replacement Lever out first thing Monday morning.I should have it by Wednesday. I think I scared them into hurrying up lol...Once I started talk of swapping the Plus SS for the GP shifter, they(hm) became kinda quiet/"deaf" with email responses etc. I do believe the 14rs do come equipped with a pretty good slipper clutch and Yes and that's true about the downshifter feature...I was told its programmable but you have to have a relay or module to actually downshift. I decided to just stick with the Plus SS and buy a standalone downshifter in the near future. I also tried to get a quote for the GP shifter but was never responded to.

* Last updated by: 14isKing on 3/22/2019 @ 11:40 PM *

It is strange that they wouldn't jump on a customer willingly asking to be upsold. Perhaps they make these units per order and would rather sell what has been built rather than hold onto inventory. Thanks for the info. I'll keep dreaming about that HM GP. Let us know how you like the HM Plus with SS.

Here is a video of the problem I have with my standard HM Plus without SS. I do not know if setting sensitivity has much to do with it but currently use the lowest sensitivity so that the shift pedal is loaded as much as possible before the kill. No real improvement, IDT. Next I will try changing to GP shift pattern and adjusting the shift knuckle angle. After that, it's time to experiment with ditching the module and trying the PC5 quick shifter utility. As long as the strain gauge is just a switch that completes a circuit to ground, it should work the same as a DJ shifter if I hook the wire up to the PC5 instead of to the HM module.

* Last updated by: Rook on 3/23/2019 @ 6:47 PM *

@Rook ..yeah kind of disappointing... but generally I'm still happy and excited to receive the new HM Pluss SS lever..(Praying this one...they corrected the splines so I can mount the damn thing lol). At the end of the day I do want the best performance for my bike but the reality is I'm not a professional racer etc. and I'm not really one of those guys who buys motorcycles to beat them to crap in 5-10k miles so I'm content with what's coming.I do hope the sensitivity/ kill time issues are minor though. I have heard as you said, changing the shift pattern to gp might help quite a bit because it's easier to run through the gears at a much higher and accurate rate. The thing I also wonder about...So the lever I'm getting says its road shift pattern only but if I get rearsets could I change the shift pattern to gp possibly!?

The thing I also wonder about...So the lever I'm getting says its road shift pattern only but if I get rearsets could I change the shift pattern to gp possibly!?

The pedal/sensor/module HM Plus SS all in one like you are getting must not have the contract/extend selection setting. They must be assuming that product will not get used for racing.

If you get Sato rear sets, they come with standard shift pedal. you can buy a Sato GP shift pedal at an extra cost. The Sato GP shift pedal has a him joint on top rather than underneath so it works in reverse. I have seen members modify a Vortex Rearset to GP shift by placing the shift knuckle pointing up. You probably could do that with a Sato as well. The Gen1 seemed to require a small edge of fairing to be trimmed or else the reset shimmed out a bit so the shift rod would clear. I believe the Gen2 does not have this problem to solve when converting to GP shift.

Sweet! It's something I'm thinking about doing the down the line for sure. That makes sense indeed. I want to see how my initial setup will perform before any adjustments. The weather out here in California sucks. I swear it's like one day of sun and 4-5 days of straight rain consistently. Lol

LOL don't even ask me about the weather in N Wisconsin!! It's not raining but we still have 5 inch deep puddles everywhere. Nice to see it melting though. I don't ride until June anymore. To dirty and not warm enough for good traction.

Lol mannnnn Wisconsin... I could only imagine the weather you get. Proshift finally responded to me about their DBS system.. I have no doubt its probably a quality piece but geez at $1320 for ou bikes whoa!! Maybe later lol

WOW. I wonder what the blipper would cost for the HM GP. I'll bet that is pricey too otherwise HM would make their own.

Yep, I think HM makes a Blipper assist like trans logic but its only for certain bike applications or you have to call for special orders. But yeah maybe down the road.. might try Proshifts DBS system. Quality stuff there as well!! Really wish translogic would have still been making more applications for our bike. I would have went with them and been done with it.lol

* Last updated by: 14isKing on 3/25/2019 @ 2:07 PM *