I just installed a Yoshimura R77 4:1 full exhaust on my 2006 ZX14. I have the secondary flies out and a K&N air filter... bike is running slightly rich with the PCIII Map I found on their site for a similar Yosh (but not the R77) with "flies out and stock or aftermarket air filter."

I was wondering if anyone had a good tune I could work from for this or a very similar setup?

Bike is definitely lighter and faster, but I often get a "pop" on decel around 3500 and below 3500 seems too rich, as it is bogging down a little... exhaust also doesn't get nearly as hot as I would expect, indicating a rich condition.

feel free to email me a tune at debusch@gmail.com.

I often get a "pop" on decel around 3500 and below 3500 seems too rich, as it is bogging down a little... exhaust also doesn't get nearly as hot as I would expect, indicating a rich condition.

That's all normal. You might lessen the popping with a custom tune. 3500 you should have power enough to open it 100% in any gear. 3000, actually is plenty. I have mine tuned to where I can WOT in 6th gear at 2000 rpm and it runs smooth so that is possible. I don't think it's real necessary though because if I'm goingto go fast I'm going to downshift up into at least the 4000 rpms. A full system is way cooler than stock exhaust. That doesn't necessarily mean rich.

I'd suggest a custom tune if it really is bogging at 3500. Or get Autotune for PC3. I have a tutorial on how to self tune. ...although it probably has no pics right now. Although mine is for PC5.

http://zx14ninjaforum.com/messages.cfm?threadid=82EE3378-978F-4244-17A47B554179390E

I appreciate all the info, Rook. I haven't really posted here, but have followed your posts for literally years, so thanks for all the good info ever since I first bought my 14. I've followed your guides for things like (I think it was yours, anyway) fairing removal, maintenance interval things, etc.

Anyway, I actually decided to look on PC's site at 2008 models and low and behold they had a Yoshi R77 full exhaust map for "stock or aftermarket air filter." To the best of my knowledge, the fuel map on the 2008s (for the low-end) should be pretty good for a 2006 with the flies out, right? above 3000 was a big difference from the map i was using, so I'm gonna give it a try and I think it will probably be quite a bit better.

I am pretty confident the current map was running rich for a couple other reasons - lots of condensation build-up after riding, to the point where my month old exhaust had dripping on it.. (we haven't had any rain) and little rust-like spots I polished off. Also, the smell.. and my mileage decreased about 1mpg.. although that could be many things, including how much more throttle I'm enjoying throwing at it :)

The R77 map is noticeably lower in many spots than the old map I had, as well.

I will check out your tuning guide, though, for sure!! Thanks!

Also, with my old map i could pretty much open it 100 percent at any spot and take off. With this one under 3000 just feels a little... wimpy... above 3000 is a rocketship, though.

Thanks, buschdog. Glad if was able to help in the past.

To the best of my knowledge, the fuel map on the 2008s (for the low-end) should be pretty good for a 2006 with the flies out, right? above 3000 was a big difference from the map i was using

The 2008 had a little different injectors. Smaller holes, more holes but the volume of fuel probably is similar. I never heard of fuel economy changing from 06-07 to 08-11 so I would think they used about the same amount of fuel. If both maps are for flies out, I'd think they'd be similar but since the 08 flies open at 3000, there would be less adjustment compared to an 06 map which would adjust for flies out all the way to 6000 rpm. If you're seeing the 08 map having lower numbers 3000-6000 rpm, that sounds normal to me.

Dynojet isn't known for the best mapping unfortunately. IDK if this is so or not. Mine ran fine with flies out and stock exhaust using a DJ flies out stock exhaust map but there was exactly 0 improvement in flies out performance. It felt like they were still in. Same deal with the tuner who I bought the Tsukigi from. His map felt pretty much the same as flies in. One AutoTune adjustment helped. Romans map was a big improvement on the flies out throttle response and self tuning just about eliminated every last trace of lag under 3000 rpm. From what I can tell, you need to have the proper fueling or just removing the flies doesn't do much for an 08-11. I'm sure it's a big change on the 06-07 though...but you still might get smoother with a tune. Hope you can get it smoothed out with just a map but if not, AutoTune is not too complicated to use if you are going to just tune the low end. Top end, you do a lot of major law breaking that most of us would get tossed in jail for.

Also, with my old map i could pretty much open it 100 percent at any spot and take off. With this one under 3000 just feels a little... wimpy... above 3000 is a rocketship, though.

* Last updated by: Rook on 10/17/2017 @ 3:56 PM *

I found a place out here that will tune it - so when I'm ready I'll go to them.

However, I tried the R77 map and it was noticeably smoother, but since it didn't say "flies out" I'm not sure if it's better overall or not. It runs smoothly, but I felt a small "dead spot" around 4000-5500 from the previous map.

So, what I did is go through the previous map and average out the numbers in the areas I thought each one excelled. If the old one felt a little better at 5000 rpm and had a difference of 15 from the new map in the table in the PC software, I put it right between them. I'll give it a try tonight and see how it feels.

Either way, I've never loved the bike more :)

* Last updated by: buschdogg on 10/17/2017 @ 11:27 AM *

hmmmm ... rogue tweaking of 3D maps?

So, what I did is go through the previous map and average out the numbers in the areas I thought each one excelled.

I felt a small "dead spot" around 4000-5500 from the previous map

I have to find out what timing adjustments to make on a Gen1.

Hey guys, just checking in. Rook exactly what information do you need ? Second how will you be making these adjustments ?

Dubble R!!

Dubble R!!

Hey guys, just checking in. Rook exactly what information do you need ? Second how will you be making these adjustments ?

I have your description of timing curve adjustments for NA saved in my PMs. I guess I would like to show you a pic of the Ignition Table before to varify it's set properly.

I'm sure I can tune NOS AFR myself but I'll need a NOS timing map. Progressive controller and bottles are going on this winter --maybe a spray bar so I'll be ready to start tuning next Spring.

I haven't had the opportunity to fire up the DJ system yet so I can check if your timing is included in the map you gave me. Pretty sure I checked two summers ago and no ignition tables.

* Last updated by: Rook on 10/18/2017 @ 3:46 PM *

Sent you a PM Romans.

Or buschdogg send your ECU to Romans or Nels and get it reflashed. No need for a PC 3 anymore then.
Nels does good work I hear as well as some positive reviews of others on here.

Mad

I'm holding out for the latest Seabass flash. It smells fishy but it comes with a money-forward guarantee.

Sent you a PM Romans.

Reply sent. First spray 40hp ?

Rook if you look below it's much easier for me to show truths as examples. Shown are the timing maps comparing the Gen 1 next to the Gen 2.

Now if you look closely you can see how where and when kawi engineers start to pull timing. Use this as your guide. Study your 100% throttle column. often detonation occurs where the hp and torque lines meet.

So to make my point, spray after those high timing numbers and only on the TPS positions you have pulled some timing.

* Last updated by: Romans on 10/23/2017 @ 6:28 PM *

Off topic but what did you guys do about photobucket bending us over for money... I was going to post other pics here on this thread but looks like now I can't without paying huge doe wtf.

what did you guys do about photobucket bending us over for money... I was going to post other pics here on this thread but looks like now I can't without paying huge doe wtf.

I have started using the forum pic hosting. Highly recommended you figure out some way to reference the pics by alphabetical order because that's how they get organized and no way to change that.

Photobucket sucks!

Regarding the timing maps comparing Gen1 and Gen 2, I presume a smaller number means ignition at FEWER degrees before TDC.

If so, the map on the left is more aggressive at larger TPs across the powerband (grey, red and in between).

The map on the left is a lot more conservative in midrange rpm at moderate TPs (orange/blue).

Intersting both maps are so similar at high rpm / moderate throttle (yellow).

I would say the map on the right is Gen 2. The edgier top end on the left belongs to the Gen1. Is that correct?

SO, if 10° BTDC at low TP/rpm is my most aggressive timing and 30° BTDC is my most conservative timing, 20° is about in the middle. Pull timing as described in your PM and the light blue should be kind of safe-ish for nitrous. Stick with the solid 30° zone (dark blue), pull timing as you prescribe and that should be safest.

I would say the map on the right is Gen 2. The edgier top end on the left belongs to the Gen1. Is that correct?

Interesting both maps are so similar at high rpm / moderate throttle (yellow).

No sorry that is incorrect. But very easy to see how you made that assumption. You may have read on how the kawi Engineers made big changes in the mapping for the stroker motor of the 14R. But the fact remains the timing maps are very close. Especially after we flash the ECU and add in the missing 2 degrees.(Shhhhh I think that's a secret) But do the math yourself using the pictures above. After careful study you may Now understand why I hate the timing maps of the Gen1.

SO, if 10° BTDC at low TP/rpm is my most aggressive timing and 30° BTDC is my most conservative timing, 20° is about in the middle. Pull timing as described in your PM and the light blue should be kind of safe-ish for nitrous. Stick with the solid 30° zone (dark blue), pull timing as you prescribe and that should be safest.

Yes but how are you activating the spray ? When and what RPM ? Throttle blade Micro switch safe and Easy. Simple set up. Do tell.

buschdogg did you get sorted with your tune ?

Yes but how are you activating the spray ? When and what RPM ?

Drives two nitrous stages and purge solenoid. NC-2 is capable of 40 amp output on each stage
Each stage is independently programmable based on throttle position, RPM, vehicle speed, time delay, and first gear lockout. NC-2 adds capability for RPM or time based progressive control

I've got a lot of (more) learning to do. Any pearls of wisdom you can impart are much appreciated. You still reachable by the two mobile phone #s? I'll get international calling.

* Last updated by: Rook on 10/23/2017 @ 9:55 PM *

I need a map for the same exhaust and line, but for a 2013 zx14r guys, please help me