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Thread: '21-'22 off season

Created on: 10/13/21 07:05 PM

Replies: 29

VicThing


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21-22 off season
10/13/21 7:05 PM

Hey all, I'm back! I posted in Off Topic as my "welcome back" post. Anyway, here's a continuation of that.

Next year I want to do a track day or two. So if you have recommendations based on some of my maintenance topics please keep that in mind.

I'm getting ready to do the following...

completed
oil change - new 0008 filter, Valvoline 4T Full Synthetic, replaced oil drain plug with aluminum drilled with magnet (potentially for safety wiring)
21-10-18 - replaced spark plugs and intake filter (OE plugs and filter)
21-10-19 - chain wear inspection - 23,700 miles and like NEW! (wipe and lube every 400 miles with 80/90 gear oil)
21-11-20 - received serviced and upgraded forks and shocks from Traxxion
21-11-21 - mounted new rear tire (M7RR)

to do

front tire
Throttle body sync
replace front brake pads (inspect rear, may replace, fronts at 50%)
replace bearings/lub steering head
rear suspension dissasembly

Pre-season
Flush/bleed brakes and clutch

Advice?
Riding this year I could tell the forks and possibly shotck need servicing. I can imagine the fork fluid probably being used up pretty well with how I rode the first 3 years. There was a definite feeling of some flightiness of the front end just not feeling properly dampened. I don't know 100% if the rear shock is servicable at all, or is that a replace only item?

Performance wise the stock suspension is pretty doggone good for me. In spirited/performance riding I haven't found it significantly lacking. So I'm not too concerned with upgrades, although it's something I would consider. I know popular mods are upgraded cartridges and springs and that sort of thing. Really, I think stock is fine.

I'm debating buying the stuff to do the forks myself. But that's kind of the thing, I'm not sure it makes sense for me to spend a couple hundred bucks on tools, and it's really just as much storing additional tools that will rarely get used. I'm fairly sure a local bike shop can do the servicing for what is a reasonable price. Or do you think, after a good track day, the forks should be serviced (minimally fluid change)? If that's the case, I might just go ahead and buy the tools.

Brake rotors. I have 2 sets of rims, and have been rotating them as tire changes. They all have their own rotors, so I don't have to swap those parts around. My question is, is there any "quality" do-it-yourself method for honing the rotors?

Tires - part of my thinks using the Q3s (190 rear) for the track day(s) and M7-RR (195) for street. But I do like the 195 width tires over the 190s for that bit of extra turn in. Any thoughts one way or the other?

I know a few of you guys have done track days and do extensive maintenance to your bikes. I appreciate any advice you have to offer.


* Last updated by: VicThing on 11/20/2021 @ 12:17 PM *

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Hub


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/13/21 10:03 PM

LTNS Vic,

Advice:
Stay stock suspension... it's trackday, not racing.
Leave rotors alone... may warp sooner with less material-no heat exchange being too thin.
Tire wise, who cares. Just get the pressures right so the tire wears well.

Front end is more locking the one fork to spec out of the top crown. Torque the lower pinch bolts. Torque the center crown nut. Torque the top pinch bolt. Slide the other fork up the tree and run the axle in so it acts like a wheel bearing. That more or less tells you the front end is square to the triple tree.

For example: guy asked me to look at his bike. Steered fine one direction, then felt sketchy traversing the other direction. Walked up to the bike and the first instinct was to check the fork tube level out of the top crown. Sure enough, one was higher than the other. We did the axle trick and all was fine.

So I look at that fork level balance right down to a hair's difference. If it feels weird with that much difference out the top crown, then I treat that axle not being freed up as the same turn-turn-sketchy-situation. Only less exaggeration, but in mm.

I too just changed all brake fluid a month or two back, then came the first valve adjustment, plugs changed, front end lube, and coolant change. No fork oil change. Oil/filter was just a few weeks back, and the valves/cool/plugs/front end was last week.

What a difference a new set of plugs make on this bike. No throttle body check. Feels like new. Used the same valve cover rubber and donuts. Zero leaks.

____________________________________________
Trackday and that day's pit layout:

Tire warmers... Take the one or two day outing of the year vs. every change you get during the year. So no, save the money on warmers, a generator, more gas cans, more maintenance. The deal here is to do about 3 slow/aggressive laps and then pin it from there on without using warmers.

Track air pressures... The tire warmer pressure check is 'hot off the warmers.' More or less, someone is suiting up and you are about to go out on the bike. So now is the time to set the number, and off goes the warmers. Where you are going to set the tires cold. So say we are hot off the warmers at 30-31psi front, and say 29 rear off the warmers. Cold wise, you want maybe 3 or less pounds to reach HOTW pressures?

Tire reading... The gumball deal is out. Cold sheer is a rainbow line [if I recall]? The visual is more looking at a lake with a soft breeze that has this ripple effect on the water. Meaning, no white caps, choppy waves, but more a lake ripple covering and zero gumballing; even at the edges. It's more a black art and a lot of experience correlating air pressures to surface profiles. Do a few Dave Moss vids to catch the tire readings to air pressure.

Track reading... Your basics are more or less is the first rule. Look way out ahead. Maybe the second rule is; be smooth first. Another way of looking at the line is like playing pool and the angle of approach. Apex is the pocket. You either turned too early, too late, or just right. Not that they are wrong once in play race wise.

Track levels... As you would think, C for slow group; B for advanced; A for the fast guys. Whereas, I'd enter C, clean the field as if, and get kicked up to the other groups. Where you never take your eye off the ball and look back to get out of someone's way? No, it's always eyes looking way out and find the line thru the turn, fuck the rest of the riders. Slow is smooth and you find that first and speed follows. Speed is the fastest you can get there and slam on the brakes, whereto next? But if you run slower and find the smoother line. Make sense?

Track gear... For sure you're high boots and full leathers. Are you knee down? What for? You know the peg tickler hits first? Grind those down first. Then we'll talk about knees. No wait, grind down the pegs so they are both sharp as razors. The ticklers were long gone. Now we'll talk about knee pucks.

Bike's mode setting... For sure you want to remove the 500 rpm adder and move the rev limiter lower. Why? Gearing. You're at this point of, I need to shift up, but I'll lose, or I topped out and need to shift up, but I'm about to shift down; for the straight was not properly geared. So say you could use a few more/less teeth at the sprocket(s), but the lower rpm level rev limiter saves the engine; I over-revved a gear. Then another setting is start with less power and run the rain or lowest mode. Take a few sessions in low. If you come out of a corner and hammer it out of there, less chance of it slipping and breaking traction. Then after lunch break, go full open mode and now feel the difference and watch out. Maybe 2nd or 3rd about 7,500 rpm I can feel the front tire dance in the air. And that's with the default mode F1. Yeah you can, but I wouldn't bounce so many hundreds of pounds on the neck and all that smoothing going out the window.

What did I miss?



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Hub


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/15/21 6:47 PM

What I missed was catching the rez low on coolant. It finally burped the air pocket out. At first I filled the radiator, lit it off, let it sink some; topped it off; lit it off so the thermostat would open... but then it started to come up and I shut it down. It was high enough to put the cap back on and let it finish off on a few runs... come to find out.

Yeah, I could squeeze the hoses some, but the slinky is a pain to move so I'm just saying, it's going to take a few rides watching for the rez level to drop. I filled it to the upper mark, and I guess the different color green was catching my eye for a few days. Then I saw the drop well under the lower mark.

Just letting the coolant droppers in on Plan B if you thought you had Plan A covered.



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VicThing


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/15/21 7:27 PM

Thanks for the reply Hubster! Lots of good info. I definitely agree with the gumball tire thing...good god there is no way someone with severely overheated tires like that are going to go faster. Sounds like some good beginning track tips. I might just do the tire warmer thing, I've got a generator, canopy tables, and all that.

I have racing experience in many forms, that I understand many fundamentals of racing. Quite honestly, I probably have the equivalent of a few track days on my bike, although it's never been on the track. I know you and no one else ever believed me, but I used to ride hard. It's been long enough I might try to dig up an old video or two, which I couldn't post for whatever types of reasons someone shouldn't post such things. Also the quality isn't great.

So a couple questions (for anyone especially those with track experience) - in general should the fork fluid/forks/shocks be serviced after a track day? Or 3? I know there's a lot of variables, different tracks, riders, weight, etc. Just kind of talking in general. I seem to recall reading that it's very possible to use up fork fluid when riding hard (from heat, etc.)

Brake rotor hone - I'm not looking at machining. But I have wondered if perhaps one reason I'm not super happy with my EBC HH pads is that they were put on unprepared rotors. I wonder if the little occasional low speed shutter I get may be due to this. Probably not... but I don't think running a hone on them would remove a significant amount of material, just like honing a cylinder wall.

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Hub


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/16/21 10:28 AM

Vic, a good question, but it makes me think about all those dealers with those car lifts and how many times have they changed the oil in those? Floor jack oil is almost forever is the life of that one seal, and if it cracks? Then you change the fluid and seal.

So I would think the oil is in need of a change when 10w is swapped for 15w say, as far as improving dive and the heavier oil slows things down. But after every 3 races? Imagine the cycling the engine oil [heat] takes v. a set of fork oil heat. Doubt the breakdown at the fork oil needs that high a servicing, sans the weight change when handling is in need of a change.

Disc to pad, that takes some research. But with stock pads or a softer compound that is going to chew up the disc, you might stay with the stock pads to see how deep you can go. First time out and all that stuff, you have too much in front of you to worry about [super deep] braking. Yes, bike will shudder during hard braking. I have video if you want to see, but you override that kind of stuff.

With the 10x to keep the gas/body cool, the gennie, a set of warmers, the trick to those is to feel the rim for heat, not the tire. Then you set the hot number and remember it still cools down once you leave the pit and wait for the green to wave. It's still a few laps before I'd pin it.

I know you and no one else ever believed me, but I used to ride hard. It's been long enough I might try to dig up an old video or two..

Hey, we're in the same boat. You say level and I say level. In my era you could have lapped me. See what I'm saying? But you were not out there being shown how you need to step it up from street speeds. I'm not saying you're not fast, I'm just saying you cannot compare the two.

I'll say that if you enter the A group starting out, they might take you out as... how did that old fart beat me... but you are not taking in what I call being 'toned.' All that practice and race, weekend after weekend builds up a mental to physical level of... what did I get myself into? That's why I let them go, being, they are trackday/racers out on a weekend ride and I'm in no shape to stay up with that group. It's a mental lift of adapting to the higher speeds. That's the zen or tone you get out of running lap after lap. Besides, you'll find yourself and finding your limits. We are no King Kenny or Steady Eddie types. That's the kind of level if you need a ladder of levels.

Which sounds better head game wise, they throwing you out of the slowest rider group, or the embarrassment of getting kicked out of the A Group. I mean, being in the way of the more 'toned group' A group you think you should be in? It's an eye opener. Still a good attitude to bring to the track is confidence. Not saying you'll never be in the A group. What I'm trying to make clear is it's all about you and any speed you like. There is always someone faster than you, right?

I'm just saying to bring smooth to the track, not speed. There is more brake than you can ever use, more HP you can use, and it's down to out riding the bike, not the bike riding you. Here is the reality. A race standard braking system does not make you the better rider. I can't play a note on the guitar I have now, a high end guitar does not make be a better player.

Cut a paper plate out and cover the speedo. Just watch the tach and never look back.


* Last updated by: Hub on 10/16/2021 @ 10:29 AM *



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VicThing


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/18/21 9:10 PM

Got a start on things today. Most of the body work off, changed air filter and spark plugs. Air filter had 11,000 miles (blew out before riding this year). Not sure on spark plugs, probably somewhere around 8000-12000 miles.




* Last updated by: VicThing on 10/18/2021 @ 9:11 PM *

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Hub


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/19/21 10:38 AM

Say you read from left to right... #2 has the most wet ring [photo angle wise] at the end of the threads. Mine only had one wet ring as well. Dry plug threads-is a good thing. If the threads were wet, it says it does not have a good sealing lock between ring and wall.

AC is up for changing and you're close to that mileage interval. If you still have the steel mesh sneeze plate on, take a razor to the melted pins that hold it in place and run without it. Does make a difference smoothing wise.

If you're down that far with the fairings off, might as well finish off with a valve set. 15k is first valve check. Do it now. Look for the white decal, left side, middle of frame. That shows shim min/max and aim for max gap. I set all mine up with the widest gap setting. Kind of does two things... one is the exhaust side; you have a touch more [power] stroke ending with the valve opening later. Secondly, the interval is more or less the same if you let whatever valves that were within spec alone. Rather, you set all the shims up loose, you send the next mileage inspection a little later down the road with the wider gap.

As far as the front cover 'boot-plate' for a better description, study it. Up to you, but I set the radiator away from the front area with a few bungees. This way, I would not have to struggle removing the boot-plate off the valve cover. Might want to take a photo of how the boot is mounted now. Stabbed a little bit of goop on the boot so the screw hole access was not struggling to line up with what bolts up to the boot-plate.

You also have to yank both front engine hangers, and that means the left brace bar is removed also. I kept whatever on the brace bar. For me, the valve cover rubber stayed on and the cover popped right back onto it. Rubber boot engine cover was not a problem I thought it would be.

The tensioner setting can be followed either by book or what my attempt was-to think out of the box. That hyvo chain will jump a tooth big time without that tensioner in play, and the chain tower [for a better name] mounted. So when you reverse the crank, you want that top chain guide in place so the chain does not walk up out of both sprockets. All you want is the long chain slipper to go as far back as it can against the cylinder wall. Then with a small gap the thickness of a business card, you want to feel the tensioner rattle and have that much back and forth. Then tap the tensioner so the ring you walked the screw-piston back into its locking position, you could either tap the tensioner, crank the shaft backwards, or in gear and turn the crank backwards that way, but I mean give it a short shocking snap in the reverse direction.

In other words, the practice is to send the tensioner's piston home, walk the mounting threads out a turn from its seat, run the crank backwards and watch the tensioner leave from its seat and extends away from the cylinder head's base. Then hand push and see how you can't move the tensioner back to the head without more load on the tensioner. Screw it in from there and you'll wear everything down. That's why you just want it off the base and screwing it in that close will not matter.

Here is what I do. I mark the sprocket tooth to chain link at their 12 o'clock positions, after I find #1 TDC-Compression stroke. I can keep one cam in place and roll the other cam away from the shim buckets. With the rubber cover still on the head and you need to use the head's horizontal line to time it back in, I just roll the cams back, and they line right back up-no need for the sprocket dots and whatnot.

This was my loophole for setting this generation tensioner. Works the same way on the next gen tensioner.

Don't know how much shim/cam work you've gone thru, but if you have the book, find all 8 shim gaps on #1 TDC-C and the other 8 gaps on the #4 TDC-C setting. Maybe Rook has a valve setting thread on here, but I roll it back to #1 T, then remove the intake first, meaning, roll that back without pulling the cam out and laying it on a bench in other words.

I select the shims for the intakes, roll the cam back on and tighten the cam caps till they bottom on the head. No torque just snug. See where I'm at gap wise. I leave the intake in place, now roll the exhaust out of the way and read my chart to shim gap and all that. Roll the ex back in and I'm ready to move to #4 and check those 8's all over again. If I need more gap, I can choose to remove the intake, and take care of those on the #4 round, or when #1 is in place I can roll either cam out and now see what Rook's does and his bird killing way with the shims.

In other words, you made no mention about shim work and if turtle says better now than later, let's think of a third variable about wide shim gap to track. The longer the valve sits on the seat, the cooler is the head transfer to valve is it sits longer to transfer under extreme hot day track day riding... think.

Signed,
NOLTT



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VicThing


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/19/21 4:02 PM

I did valve clearance at 15k. It should be a good season next year, may hit the 30k mark. If so I'll do that next off season. Here's an old pic of the cams out.

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VicThing


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/19/21 6:34 PM

This evening performed the chain wear inspection. Wow...all I can say is anyone not using 80/90 gear oil is seriously wasting chains. This bike has 23,700 miles on it. And the chain is basically like NEW. 21 links measured right at 12.50". Checking the chain for general play, she's tight. Barely any side to side movement. Rollers are a little loose. I've can get another good season out of it, that'll work. Maybe plan on replacing next off season.

Tonight also removed front and rear wheels. I also inspected the the chain more carefully for binding and found the chain to be remarkably consistent.. I was a little worried during the course of this season as to the health of the chain, simply because of miles. But wow...NO MORE! Let er rip!

I haven't looked at the sprocket carefully but she still looks in at least good shape.

My routine - proper slack adjustment, proper alignment. and faithfully cleaning (wiping down with rag) and lubing the chain every 400 miles with 80/90 gear oil with chain warmed then allowed to cool.

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Hub


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/19/21 10:05 PM

Not worried about your mechanical aptitude, Vic, just mentioning the subtle R&R points. This one goes back to the early 90's. Took a break from wrenching on bikes and wanted some car background. They put me on heavy line, which is engine/trans/rear end jobs.

The Chevy Suburbans had a 4x4 transfer case that would shatter a locking C-clip on a mainshaft. Dealers went through a lot of them as did others. I did a shitload. Franchises have to comply with; CSI = consumer satisfaction index. That's where you are handed the bill/or under warrantee, and ask to a fill out your experience and send it to the factory or dealer, I forget.

Factory comes out with a service bulletin that says the complaint is a noise under the floorboard after a transfer case rebuild. Bulletin next explains that when you remove the hyvo chain, time the gear tooth to the chain link so the pattern does not start a new one and hummmm thru the floorboards.

So from then on, and I'll add not to worry about the engine, because I know engines that run forever if miss-key'd... and these are race engines so as not to be anal on assembly. Just pointing out what the engineers came up with. With that said, I mentioned I do not remove the cams but keep them keyed as per [no] new wear [pattern]... Whaa-whaa.

Besides the cam sprocket to chain link I also apply it to the drive chain. Maybe one time I counted 65 wheel spins before the two marks on the chain and sprocket lined up again. Second tire change and the chain has zero hi/lo spots. In fact, never adjusted the chain since new until today in fact. There might be a couple of tube(s) full of grease packed in the C/S-shift cover.

Pull out is link-pin-elongation and your 12.5 would be longer, right? And if you push up on the chain, you want to see how much tooth-elongation the sprocket has. Not that I'd use new with old. I'd play the chain out to the loosest-stretch spec, or this side of it. No guessing when to change the set.

Trip A is for oil changes. Trip B is when to lube the chain at 300 miles. I use STP marine grease. It's so caked on the rim and swingarm, I'll clean it when the tires need to be changed.

Whaa-whaa-watch it next time.

And to mention the subtle things again, the list is more like who gives a crap about:
1. Rollers... if they are not cracked in half and spit off... who gives a shit.
2. Side to side... means jack shit. It's still going to line up at the bottom rung.
3. Tooth elongation... as long as the chain does not ride over it... fuck it.

But that one pin being eaten away on the one side is the staked pin in the link being torn on half its side. What you can't see is why the links grow long is half is gone, or close to it. Curls around the smaller sprocket and that's more eat to elongate. That's 12.7" or this side of my worry number. I'm sure you meant 20 links.



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VicThing


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/20/21 8:21 PM

Hub I don't know what the hell you're trying to state. Sounds like a nice story, but it's just that, a story, and whatever events occurred pertained to that story, then, and your perception of those events. Otherwise, there is no direct correlation of some event you experienced 20 years ago and some event happening here and now. IE, any relation is happenstance. Considering motorcycles have been around 100s of years and 10s of millions of motorcycles have been manufactured there are probably 1000s of stories which really are relatable to the topics at hand. If you have points to make, just make them in plain English, you're not "the riddler".

Back to the log. Tonight got the front forks removed, cleaned up some parts, and started removing the steering head. I need a tool for the lower retaining nut.

The further I dig into this bike the more impressed I am of Kaw's engineering. While yes, they could've made this or that part lighter, more machining, or different materials the fact is they did an amazing balance between producing something affordable yet still highly optimized. That's always part of the balance, sure they probably could've made this bike weigh 500lbs. But it would probably mean instead of around $15K (the price a few years ago) it would've been $50k. Or to say, they could've gave us 100% for 50k, but instead settled on giving us 90% for 15k. That last 10% is extremely expensive.


4 images of 23.7k mile sprocket after cleaning, on left. right sprocket is new


Upper 23.7k sprocket, bottom new

left new sprocket, right 23.7k

historical image at 15k miles


* Last updated by: VicThing on 10/20/2021 @ 8:23 PM *

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Rook


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/21/21 9:46 PM

I actually think Hub might be the Riddler.



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE Now Deceased

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Hub


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/22/21 7:16 PM

No no, Vic, continue. I'm impressed with the 90w and your high maintenance upkeep. When I change the tires I'll check mine the same way. 90w outperforms marine grease, I'm in.



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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/23/21 8:58 AM

Hub, I apologize as I did not necessarily intend to say gear oil is better than every other possible method, especially your or the marine grease method. I know you've spoken highly about the method you use, and if you're seeing longer chain and sprocket life then those are the facts. If you said "I get 80,000 miles out of mine" I would believe you, and that might influence me to use and at least try that method.

Honestly I was just super surprised and really was expecting to be replacing my chain now. And by the specified Kaw method (measure center of links 1 to 21 with chain taught (20lbs on bottom), , and reviewing some "chain wear inspection" processes I was just blown away by the actual condition of my chain.

What I can say for most certain is, given the time, expense, and mess of highly marketed chain waxes and things along those lines and people are burning through chains and sprockets in a couple seasons... well marketing is a science for a reason. Lot of that in life especially these days. People have no idea how much marketing is used to make a decision for them, while they believe they are the one's making the best decision. Geez... no relatable stories there is there. And the thing about you is, I think you'll listen to marketing, facts, and hype, and then make your own decision. So I'm not (proverbially) worried about you.

I'd be glad to make a video or something of the chain itself, if it might help understand more where it "is at" as far as condition and wear and tear. Seriously, in my hands, it feels like a chain right out of the box. I've never even cleaned it with any sort of cleaners, although I might try to devise some way to deep clean the rollers since most likely I'll have it off the bike (going to remove rear swing arm).

LOL...Rook...secretly I think he might be too...don't tell anyone!

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Rook


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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/24/21 6:09 PM



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE Now Deceased

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RE: '21-'22 off season
10/29/21 8:38 PM

Got the shock removed tonight. That turned out to be a little adventure.

The last few years I haven't been particularly active mechanically. This year has re-peaked some interest in that, along with riding, but I'm a little rusty at both. For example at the beginning of the year...when I prepped my bike to start riding I forgot...(this is a little embarrassing)...how push pins worked. I was like...damn...there's some trick to this. At any rate, About my little adventure tonight. Part of the fun...buy the ticket take the ride.

So I started working to remove the rear shock. and the bolts just didn't want to come out. And I thought, well, this is odd. Normally my rule is, particularly with bikes like this is, if you have to beat on it you're doing it wrong. But I've never done this before, and thought there must be some force on the shock and linkage that's causing the screws to bind up. So I worked on the various fastners, and all of them are bound up.

I think maybe I need to relieve some stress on the swing arm, get my jack out and support the rear swing arm a little. Doesn't help. All four fasteners are still wedged and bound up.

Then it happens. I finally get the upper shock fastener to come out and the bike starts to fall forward! I'm like WTF!? There was a couple tihngs I wasn't certain of, one is does the swingarm have a stop to it. Fortunately, it turns out, I'm not sure if it's a stop, but it definitely stops, or I'd be up shit creek without a paddle right now...where as fortunately I just had to clean my shorts.

So back to being rusty. It hadn't occurred to me that using my abba stand, that using the front lift arm stuff where I looped the pull strap too. See, I've always had the swingarm bobbin. Which is super convenient for basic mainteance, oil changes, tire change, chain lube etc.. So I raised the front end from that. When the shock let loose...so di the bike, because the front's weight was all ON the swingarm bobbin. FORTUNATELY....and because God knows I'm an idiot (what...you people thought you were the only ones that knew) the swingarm bottomed out keeping my bike from nose diving into the floor. I used my jack to prop the front end back up and looped the pull strap around the rear passenger peg...WHERE IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE for this type of servicing.

It wasn't too violent really, it happened fairly slowly but I will be sure to inspect the frame and that sort of thing. After I got the bike back up, the bolts came out very easily (like they're supposed to) so I don't think there's any damage.

At any rate, live and learn, and remember if you have an abba stand and want to remove the shock with the front end lifted to LOOP AROUND the passenger peg!

I just have to decide what to do now. OE rebuild or upgrade? Honestly just leaning towards OE rebuild. I'm going to try to get them shipped out tomorrow.


* Last updated by: VicThing on 10/29/2021 @ 8:41 PM *

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Rook


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Joined: 03/28/09

Posts: 20284

RE: '21-'22 off season
10/29/21 10:45 PM

When I removed my shock I used a swing arm pivot stand similar to the Abba and I put books under the rear tire to support the swing arm. Those bolts were awfully tight though. Torqued with thread locker? I remember cranking on that wrench really hard. The only trick I know is turn the nut rather than the bolt head whenever possible. Come to think of it, the nut flats were dented from the force I applied.



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE Now Deceased

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VicThing


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Joined: 07/17/14

Posts: 2179

RE: '21-'22 off season
10/30/21 5:16 AM

The issue wasn't unloosening, it was removing the bolts afterwards. They were binding up, undoubtedly by the twisting force being applied by the front lifted with the weight put on the left side of the swing arm (the bobbin is mounted to the left rear of the swingarm). The "swingarm bobbin" is an accessory to use when lifting the front wheel - it's mainly for convenience but it applies the force from raising the front end from the bike frame to the swingarm. And there's where I experienced the issue I did. Once the swingarm was FREE after I finally got a bolt out, the swingarm was no longer a rigid part of the frame... it pivoted on it's mount which meant the force of the weight of the front was no longer being constrained. IE, it was like I unloosed the strap... which fortunately I didn't. Had the design been different, or the strap had more play, or something like that I'd surely be picking up broken parts of a smashed front end from my garage floor right now.

This is a mistake I could see someone making fairly easily. I think if I was doing this when I was more active 4 years ago I would've remembered NOT to loop around the swingarm bobbin and instead the passenger peg bracket. Duh...my intent is to remove the swingarm...how am I going to do this when it is strapped to!? Unfortunately 1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 1 didn't add up to 5 for me.

There's the pivot action of raising the rear tire with the standard pivot stand. There's the front lift arm (accessory), which allows then pivoting the front up and off the ground. But this is done by loading the front's weight onto the rear area of the stand and bike. You push down rear of the bike, which raises the front end. So it's sort of a double pivot.

Had I only been using pivot, and the front end was solid on the ground (tire, or say a hoop) this wouldn't have happened. It was only possible because I also have the front lift arm in place with the front lifted.


* Last updated by: VicThing on 10/30/2021 @ 5:21 AM *

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Rook


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Joined: 03/28/09

Posts: 20284

RE: '21-'22 off season
10/30/21 9:51 AM

Instead you would have had the tire drop a few inches and hit the floor.

Oh well now you know. You have to support everything like it's floating in air.

The way it goes for me sometimes is I remember for years but never need to put it into practice. By the time I put it into practice, I forgot. The solution is to be totally meticulous and methodical and OCD. Nothing gets past that. You just spend a lot more time wrenching than most other people. You don't fuck your bike up though.



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE Now Deceased

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Maddevill


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Location: Hayward, CA

Joined: 04/23/11

Posts: 2511

RE: '21-'22 off season
10/30/21 10:14 AM

Hi Vic,
I have stock suspension but I had our local suspension guru rebuild and revalve
both the forks and shock. Big, big improvement over stock. But I also rode my friends
ZX with full Ohlins. OH MY FREAKING GAWD ! Felt like an entirely different bike.
Vastly better in just about every way. If you have several grand in cash laying
around, that's the direction I'd go.

Mad



Owner of KNGKAW.

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VicThing


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Joined: 07/17/14

Posts: 2179

RE: '21-'22 off season
11/02/21 8:11 AM

Mad, I'm leaning towards the basic upgrades as I sit here now through Traxxion, which would be revalve and spring rate change. What I'm most hesitant about is them understanding what I want, and not the typical perception of 14 riders are. I definitely want far more sport than tourer.

The Ohlins thing, would purely be for bling on my end. To really get the most out of something like that I think it would have to be tuned for tracks, temps, weight, etc. I don't see myself getting that deep into things. I would definitely like to put her out on a track, but definitely not worried about being the fastest person out there.

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VicThing


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Joined: 07/17/14

Posts: 2179

RE: '21-'22 off season
11/05/21 7:52 PM

Shipped my forks and shocks out yeesterday to Traxxion. Decided to go ahead and have the service and do the revalve and respring.

Today got my steering stem removed. There was no particular issue with the steering. Based on the condition, I'd say it was time for servicing. There was still grease in the bearings, but the lower races had wear spots polished into them, most likely from where riding basically straight most of the time. It might be a reason my steering felt a little heavy. I definitely recommend PMing this stuff, definitely somewhere that 20k-30k mark. I think Kaw even calls for more frequent servicing. Once again I was blown away when I realized the steering stem is aluminum. I thought for sure that would be steel...nope.

Also started working on a replacement exhaust hanger. Bought an extra RHS off Ebay. Cutting off the passenger peg bracket and luggage rack bracket. I looked at some aftermarket options, which I found surprisingly limited. I was really shocked the whole complete bracket assembly only ways 1 lb 7 oz. That's without the exhaust bolt, but everything including the mounting screws. So I figured save a couple pounds and clean up the looks a little.



1st rough cut:

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Hub


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Joined: 02/05/09

Posts: 13223

RE: '21-'22 off season
11/09/21 7:21 AM

Always refinements going on. Not that I can prove it, but first neck grease was with the plastic dust cover. It was cracked. Did they find a lot of new plastic dust covers fly out of the parts houses? Refine with a pressed in seal at the frame neck.

And Vic, am I seeing right? Did that, or is the bearing race off the triple? Came right off or is the photo looking like it is?



Tormenting the motorcycling community one post at a time

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VicThing


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Joined: 07/17/14

Posts: 2179

RE: '21-'22 off season
11/11/21 7:59 PM

I removed the bearing race. Replacing both sets.

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VicThing


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Joined: 07/17/14

Posts: 2179

RE: '21-'22 off season
11/20/21 12:09 PM

Just an update, mounted my new rear tire (M7RR). Front is yet to do, probably tomorrow. Finished sanding my modified exhaust hangar. Just need to paint. Not the best sanding job ever, but it'll look fine for it's purpose. Received back my forks and shock from Traxxion. Waiting for a race removal tool (OTC) to get the steering reassembled.

Rears always a bit of a pain because they're so wide. That I recall, Q3s were the worst though, extremely strong bead.




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