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Thread: Turbo Bug Bites

Created on: 04/18/15 06:43 AM

Replies: 76

knovikov


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Location: ohio

Joined: 01/12/11

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Turbo Bug Bites
04/18/15 6:43 AM

Nova

Every year I like to do upgrades to my 'old girl' which is an 08. She has 21k miles on her. Last year I gave her an image overhaul and this year she gets a turbo. I found a used turbo kit and pulled the trigger. It was mostly complete but I had to purchase a few extra items such as a AFR wideband gauge, turbo boost sensor, and fuel pressure gauge. I might need to get some more parts as the build progresses, but with the warmer weather I have begun the work.

I certainly welcome any suggestions as I am no expert on this matter. This can also help others who decide to go
the turbo route as my research on the web produced some answers and also questions. I am installing this myself in the garage.

The turbo, according to the seller, was used on pump gas at 6 psi. He decided to go for a larger turbo for racing purposes. I am interested in a fun street machine and do not race. After changing to a 45T rear sprocket last year, I guess I wanted even more power on the highway. Maybe the kid in me wants something even scarier than what I already have. Maybe I am jealous that the H2 can do power wheelies in 4th gear. I cant handle all the power of my bike as it sits now. There is no good reason, all I can say it is a hobby of mine.

After inspecting my 08, which I bought used, I found the injectors to be color coded blue (ie 440 cc) so those will stay and I will keep the PSI at 6.

Here are a few pics of the parts.
It is a Garrett M24 with ball bearings (turbo shaft has no play side to side, but can move slightly up/down)
Bosch 1:1 regulator (smaller unit compared to others I have seen)
External fuel pump (italian name, had no other designations) After 12v hookup appears to work.
Small oil pump (after 12v hookup appears to work).



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Rook


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Joined: 03/28/09

Posts: 18972

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/18/15 2:43 PM

Looks intreguing. I like the short pipes! Also, always good to see another guy who appreciates blue painters tape.



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE flies out, full Tsukigi Cannon exhaust, BMC race filter, Muzzy's block off plates, Super Sprox 17t output sprocket, AFM 45t rear sprocket, EK zzz 530 chain, Gilles Tooling axle adjusters, PC5, Romans map, AT-200, Ignition Module, LCD-200, Speedohealer V4, Glow-Shift gauges, Illumiglow 210 mph clock faces, HM PLUS quickshifter, Factory Pro EVO Shift Star, RC's oil pump cover, Moto-D magnetic oil drain plug, MIT billet oil filler cap, Shorai 14A2 Lithium battery, Spiegler SS clutch and brake lines, HyperPro RSC steering damper, LighTech fuel tank cap, Vortex rearsets, lightweight mudflap bracket, FP Racing preload adjusters, Ohlins FGRT807 forks and KA544 shock, Carrazzeria Tri-R wheels, Bridgeport 90° valve stems, CZ 320mm front rotors, Galfer rear wave rotor, Pazzo levers, ProBots Dzus fasteners and many other bolts replaced with aluminum or Ti, Vortex mirror blocks, CRG bar end mirrors, LSL frame sliders, axle sliders, billet bar ends, 2WheelWorkz muffler

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knovikov


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Location: ohio

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Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/18/15 3:55 PM

Hey Rook,
Been fussing with installation all day, not to mention prior days. Here are a few progress pics. The filter I got was too big, so had to modify a little. Things are kinda tight and might have to do something with the water hose.



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Romans


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Location: Toronto,ON

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RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/20/15 9:11 AM

She is coming along nicely..

I see clutch spacer but No Lock up ?

How are you controlling the fueling ?

Not sure if you are aware so I will mention, the Air Box needs to be sealed ?

Small oil pump (after 12v hookup appears to work).

I have a brand new pump still in the box if you need a spare ? I was changing those out one a year. Smoke show when they go.

How are returning oil to the pan ? Sorry just looking for what's missing. Luv this stuff.

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knovikov


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Location: ohio

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Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/20/15 3:20 PM

Hi Romans,

Thanks for posting. The spacer is used for oil return adapter as you will see in the attached pic. I do not have a lockup clutch. Dont know much about them, but I imagine they are used to control slipping. Do you think I need one?

The fueling, so far, will be controlled by by PC3. The seller provided me with a map, and upon inspection it said "6psi Spring Engine Configuration: Stock Internals and Compression Fuel Pressure @ 6lbs of Boost: 70psi minimum w/044 Bosch 80psi w/068 Bosch" Those pressure values seem high compared to what I have read on the threads. I have the blue color injectors (440 cc) on the bike. The 1:1 regulator is a Bosch and you will see what I'm working with in the pics.

Yep, the sealing of the air tank took some time for me because it kept leaking. I thought the air was leaking at the steering column, so I kept sealing even more. Finally solved the problem - it was at the Blow Off valve where it connects to the curved adapter. Sealed that with some GRAY sealant and she is air tight.

When I had the Blow Off Valve removed, I tried to push down the piston with my fingers, to see it open. Took a lot of force to accomplish that. I have serious doubts that 6 psi boost can open that up. I know this is not very scientific, but the force I had to use required some exertion. So I've included a pic of the spring as well,

The same deal down below at the turbo level. The seller told me that the springs open at 6 psi. I can run a test with an air hose tonight.

There is another pic I have included that shows the connection diagram of the external fuel pump and 1:1 regulator. There is a return line built into the gas tank. I have to cut the fuel line and install a "T" I do have a brass "T" or buy "AN" line and connections or can the stock fuel line be used?






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Romans


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Location: Toronto,ON

Joined: 02/13/09

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RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/20/15 4:44 PM

I do not have a lockup clutch. Dont know much about them, but I imagine they are used to control slipping. Do you think I need one?

Stock springs won't hold much above two hundred. Brock heavy duty springs around 260 start slipping. After this lock up

I thought the air was leaking at the steering column,

It does, make sure to plug.

There is another pic I have included that shows the connection diagram of the external fuel pump and 1:1 regulator. There is a return line built into the gas tank. I have to cut the fuel line and install a "T" I do have a brass "T" or buy "AN" line and connections or can the stock fuel line be used?

Yes.

Did you receive a T connection to the hose going to the MAP sensor with a one way check ? You will need this to insure Map sensor does not see Boost.

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knovikov


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Location: ohio

Joined: 01/12/11

Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/21/15 8:24 AM

Thanks Romans,
Found KG 805 clutch springs on ebay for $15. You can also shim the ones you have for even more stiffness. Your thoughts..

"Did you receive a T connection to the hose going to the MAP sensor with a one way check ? You will need this to insure Map sensor does not see Boost."
No. The MAP sensor i know is electrical. Can you please explain as i am green.



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Rook


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RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/21/15 9:02 AM

I don't know what a MAP sensor is but that pic you have there, that's the air temp sensor, isn't it?



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE flies out, full Tsukigi Cannon exhaust, BMC race filter, Muzzy's block off plates, Super Sprox 17t output sprocket, AFM 45t rear sprocket, EK zzz 530 chain, Gilles Tooling axle adjusters, PC5, Romans map, AT-200, Ignition Module, LCD-200, Speedohealer V4, Glow-Shift gauges, Illumiglow 210 mph clock faces, HM PLUS quickshifter, Factory Pro EVO Shift Star, RC's oil pump cover, Moto-D magnetic oil drain plug, MIT billet oil filler cap, Shorai 14A2 Lithium battery, Spiegler SS clutch and brake lines, HyperPro RSC steering damper, LighTech fuel tank cap, Vortex rearsets, lightweight mudflap bracket, FP Racing preload adjusters, Ohlins FGRT807 forks and KA544 shock, Carrazzeria Tri-R wheels, Bridgeport 90° valve stems, CZ 320mm front rotors, Galfer rear wave rotor, Pazzo levers, ProBots Dzus fasteners and many other bolts replaced with aluminum or Ti, Vortex mirror blocks, CRG bar end mirrors, LSL frame sliders, axle sliders, billet bar ends, 2WheelWorkz muffler

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knovikov


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Location: ohio

Joined: 01/12/11

Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/21/15 1:23 PM

You're correct Rook. Then the MAP sensor is connected to the throttle bodies. I'll have a look.

As a sidenote, Rook, have you done a clutch mod of your bike. You will be installing NOS in the near future if memory serves me correctly. Anyhow, after I pulled my clutch spring, one way you can make it tigher, is adding spacer, The other way is to use a shorter bolt. I'm always looking for ways to use less. Just a thought..



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Rook


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RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/21/15 5:27 PM

Thanks, clutch slippage from NOS boost did not occurred to me. I guess "why not?" If turbo can do it, NOS could do it too. I'm planning to remove the clutch cover this summer so I'll have to consider what I want to do.

Stock springs won't hold much above two hundred. Brock heavy duty springs around 260 start slipping. After this lock up

What are we referring to here when we say 200 and 260? I'll be doing a max of 75 shot with NOS. Should I go ahead and go all the way to a lockup clutch?

**Stage 2 lockup allows more pressure on the clutch for bikes with 360+ horsepower**

Holy crap, $370! That's almost a whole new nitrous kit! Is this necessary if I stay under 360 hp?


* Last updated by: Rook on 4/21/2015 @ 5:34 PM *



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE flies out, full Tsukigi Cannon exhaust, BMC race filter, Muzzy's block off plates, Super Sprox 17t output sprocket, AFM 45t rear sprocket, EK zzz 530 chain, Gilles Tooling axle adjusters, PC5, Romans map, AT-200, Ignition Module, LCD-200, Speedohealer V4, Glow-Shift gauges, Illumiglow 210 mph clock faces, HM PLUS quickshifter, Factory Pro EVO Shift Star, RC's oil pump cover, Moto-D magnetic oil drain plug, MIT billet oil filler cap, Shorai 14A2 Lithium battery, Spiegler SS clutch and brake lines, HyperPro RSC steering damper, LighTech fuel tank cap, Vortex rearsets, lightweight mudflap bracket, FP Racing preload adjusters, Ohlins FGRT807 forks and KA544 shock, Carrazzeria Tri-R wheels, Bridgeport 90° valve stems, CZ 320mm front rotors, Galfer rear wave rotor, Pazzo levers, ProBots Dzus fasteners and many other bolts replaced with aluminum or Ti, Vortex mirror blocks, CRG bar end mirrors, LSL frame sliders, axle sliders, billet bar ends, 2WheelWorkz muffler

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Romans


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Location: Toronto,ON

Joined: 02/13/09

Posts: 5913

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/22/15 10:54 AM

Then the MAP sensor is connected to the throttle bodies. I'll have a look.

Yes. You will see hoses coming off throttle bodies. One Air line to the MAP sensor. Check valve install here. Map sensor is not supposed to see Boost.

**Stage 2 lockup allows more pressure on the clutch for bikes with 360+ horsepower**
Holy crap, $370! That's almost a whole new nitrous kit! Is this necessary if I stay under 360 hp?


Just installed this one Click Here

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knovikov


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Location: ohio

Joined: 01/12/11

Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/22/15 5:26 PM

Thanks Romans
If factory MAP sensor is not used during boost. Is it possible to just plug the inlet air line. If I remember correctly my turbo will begin boosting at 3K RPM. Forgive me in advance if this is a dumb question. Nova



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Rook


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RE: Turbo Bug Bites
04/22/15 9:31 PM

Just installed this one Click Here

OMG! not me...not for a long time. bye bye, clutchy.



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE flies out, full Tsukigi Cannon exhaust, BMC race filter, Muzzy's block off plates, Super Sprox 17t output sprocket, AFM 45t rear sprocket, EK zzz 530 chain, Gilles Tooling axle adjusters, PC5, Romans map, AT-200, Ignition Module, LCD-200, Speedohealer V4, Glow-Shift gauges, Illumiglow 210 mph clock faces, HM PLUS quickshifter, Factory Pro EVO Shift Star, RC's oil pump cover, Moto-D magnetic oil drain plug, MIT billet oil filler cap, Shorai 14A2 Lithium battery, Spiegler SS clutch and brake lines, HyperPro RSC steering damper, LighTech fuel tank cap, Vortex rearsets, lightweight mudflap bracket, FP Racing preload adjusters, Ohlins FGRT807 forks and KA544 shock, Carrazzeria Tri-R wheels, Bridgeport 90° valve stems, CZ 320mm front rotors, Galfer rear wave rotor, Pazzo levers, ProBots Dzus fasteners and many other bolts replaced with aluminum or Ti, Vortex mirror blocks, CRG bar end mirrors, LSL frame sliders, axle sliders, billet bar ends, 2WheelWorkz muffler

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knovikov


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Location: ohio

Joined: 01/12/11

Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/02/15 5:34 PM

Your text to link here...
Rook
You can get shorter bolts for oem clutch springs, it has made a difference in clutch grab. Here is my almost finished bike. Running pretty good at above 3k, dialing in my fuel numbers to arrive at good afr #s. Taking easy on throttle so far. Got the fuel pressure set at 50 to 55 psi. The numbers do fluctuate, but I take the highest becuase it does dip by 15 pts before coming back up. Here are a few pics..


* Last updated by: knovikov on 5/2/2015 @ 5:37 PM *



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Rook


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Posts: 18972

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/02/15 9:02 PM

That is just badass crazy. That's like something from Ghost rider!

I like the Suzuki rear caliper. Mainly a cornering clearance improvement, right? I doubt I'll ever lean a 14 that far but it looks cool. Also, I like the external rear brake fluid reservoir. I planned to do that with my bike. Single front brake. Is that a part of a brake disk you have bolted to the right caliper mounts?

I think you should add nitrous to this bike just for the hell of it!



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE flies out, full Tsukigi Cannon exhaust, BMC race filter, Muzzy's block off plates, Super Sprox 17t output sprocket, AFM 45t rear sprocket, EK zzz 530 chain, Gilles Tooling axle adjusters, PC5, Romans map, AT-200, Ignition Module, LCD-200, Speedohealer V4, Glow-Shift gauges, Illumiglow 210 mph clock faces, HM PLUS quickshifter, Factory Pro EVO Shift Star, RC's oil pump cover, Moto-D magnetic oil drain plug, MIT billet oil filler cap, Shorai 14A2 Lithium battery, Spiegler SS clutch and brake lines, HyperPro RSC steering damper, LighTech fuel tank cap, Vortex rearsets, lightweight mudflap bracket, FP Racing preload adjusters, Ohlins FGRT807 forks and KA544 shock, Carrazzeria Tri-R wheels, Bridgeport 90° valve stems, CZ 320mm front rotors, Galfer rear wave rotor, Pazzo levers, ProBots Dzus fasteners and many other bolts replaced with aluminum or Ti, Vortex mirror blocks, CRG bar end mirrors, LSL frame sliders, axle sliders, billet bar ends, 2WheelWorkz muffler

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knovikov


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Location: ohio

Joined: 01/12/11

Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/03/15 3:30 AM

Thanks...to answer your questions. The rear brake caliper is from a zx6 and so are the wheels. The rear is 1/2" narrower than oem. The front brake..I cuta piece of flexiglass to look like a caliper but ended up painting it silver. Tucked inside is a strip of green led lights. I should take a pic in the evening. This is my 3rd year with the brakes and they work well for me. If you carry a passenger dual front. Before turbo omy bike was 420 lbs.. now 445??

I felt the boost for a split second last night while riding/tuning. Good afr #s above 4k rpm and while rolling on throttle. Not so good at just maintaining steady velocity. I have to richen the bottom end. I got a feeling my new girl is finicky.



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knovikov


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Location: ohio

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Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/20/15 11:02 AM

An update,

Got all new SS fuel lines, walbro pump, AEM fuel pressure regulator, and a new fuel pressure sensor.
Drilled and tapped the fuel rail for a 10mm adaptor to which I hooked up my fuel line. The fuel pressure regulator is now located in the hump behind the seat. Still, have fluctuations in fuel pressure numbers, but the AFR is on point.

Also installed a 40T rear sprocket from a 45T. This works nicely on the highway as the engine is not screaming. It feels like the boost accomplishes what high revving and larger sprocket did before. I have not run the engine past 7K rpms as the boost creeps into 7 psi, but the way she pulls at 6 psi is all I can take for now. Its a lot of fun!




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Romans


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Location: Toronto,ON

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RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/21/15 1:40 AM

Thanks Romans
If factory MAP sensor is not used during boost. Is it possible to just plug the inlet air line. If I remember correctly my turbo will begin boosting at 3K RPM. Forgive me in advance if this is a dumb question. Nova

You want the Map sensor to see vacuum. Just blind to pressure. A small one way air check valve T in line to blow off pressure.

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knovikov


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Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/21/15 12:50 PM

Rook,

You had a question about how I did my seat and here is a better picture that will clear things up. After molding the foam padding into the shape you see, then cut a piece of plexiglass to fit into that mold. The plexiglass is there to hold the shape. Then drilled a few holes, bolts, and then poured the 2 part resin to cover the bolts. You can still see the bolt under the resin in the pic. Hope this helps.



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knovikov


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Location: ohio

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Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/21/15 1:12 PM

Hey Romans,
I did install a check valve at the MAP sensor. Bought it from a pet supply store, however, it does not bleed out like you mentioned in your message. Simply stops pressure from reaching the sensor. Do I need to redo this - please explain.

The other thing that I cant figure out is why my fuel pressure sensor readings keep fluctuating drastically. I have a digital GloShift gauge and this is the second new unit that I installed with the sensor mounted 10" before the fuel rail. When the motor is running, the numbers climb to my preset pressure, then down into the teens and back up again. Same scenario even with a new fuel pressure regulator, new pump, and new fuel line plumbing. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Here is a better pic of drill and tapping into the fuel rail. I did use JB weld to ensure a leak proof seal. According to JB weld, their 2 part epoxy is petroleum resistant. No problems so far. Most other fuel line connections are - 6 AN fittings.



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knovikov


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RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/21/15 1:38 PM

Romans,

Forgot to ask you another question about "water-meth" injection. Been curious about this and from what I read it can save your pistons if boost creep sets in which is a potential problem for me. My boost creeps to about 7 psi, maybe higher, if I keep the throttle open. Get leary looking at the gauges when WOT.

Read you put the water-meth into the swingarm - very cool idea. Have you tested your setup yet? At what psi do you start to spray and what method of activation do you have?



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Rook


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Joined: 03/28/09

Posts: 18972

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/21/15 8:36 PM

You can still see the bolt under the resin in the pic. Hope this helps.

Perfect. Thanks. Damn, you do nice, clean work.



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE flies out, full Tsukigi Cannon exhaust, BMC race filter, Muzzy's block off plates, Super Sprox 17t output sprocket, AFM 45t rear sprocket, EK zzz 530 chain, Gilles Tooling axle adjusters, PC5, Romans map, AT-200, Ignition Module, LCD-200, Speedohealer V4, Glow-Shift gauges, Illumiglow 210 mph clock faces, HM PLUS quickshifter, Factory Pro EVO Shift Star, RC's oil pump cover, Moto-D magnetic oil drain plug, MIT billet oil filler cap, Shorai 14A2 Lithium battery, Spiegler SS clutch and brake lines, HyperPro RSC steering damper, LighTech fuel tank cap, Vortex rearsets, lightweight mudflap bracket, FP Racing preload adjusters, Ohlins FGRT807 forks and KA544 shock, Carrazzeria Tri-R wheels, Bridgeport 90° valve stems, CZ 320mm front rotors, Galfer rear wave rotor, Pazzo levers, ProBots Dzus fasteners and many other bolts replaced with aluminum or Ti, Vortex mirror blocks, CRG bar end mirrors, LSL frame sliders, axle sliders, billet bar ends, 2WheelWorkz muffler

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Romans


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Location: Toronto,ON

Joined: 02/13/09

Posts: 5913

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/22/15 8:49 PM

Hey Romans,
I did install a check valve at the MAP sensor. Bought it from a pet supply store, however, it does not bleed out like you mentioned in your message. Simply stops pressure from reaching the sensor. Do I need to redo this - please explain.

I would. Let the Map sensor see Vacume like was designed. Blind it to pressure. Cut the hose to the sensor. Install a T. At the end of the T one way check. Make sense ? If not I will make one up for you and take a pic.

The other thing that I cant figure out is why my fuel pressure sensor readings keep fluctuating drastically. I have a digital GloShift gauge and this is the second new unit that I installed with the sensor mounted 10" before the fuel rail. When the motor is running, the numbers climb to my preset pressure, then down into the teens and back up again. Same scenario even with a new fuel pressure regulator, new pump, and new fuel line plumbing. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

hmmm, now you have got me thinking. I've always taken fuel pressure reading after the fuel rail. Technically your reading pressure before injector use. Does it make a difference ? Don't know with out a compare at WOT.

Next, Gen 1 charging system is poor at best. Watch your voltage on the dash. Pump draw causes pressure (at idle)to fluctuate. Should always be the same at 2500 RPM. Nothing to worry about.

Have you tested your setup yet? At what psi do you start to spray and what method of activation do you have?

Yes Love it. Should have done this years ago. Start spray at 25% of full boost.

Your issue will be to much Timing. Be Careful. IMO 32.5 advance is Danger Zone.

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knovikov


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Location: ohio

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Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/23/15 9:24 AM

Glad that helps Rook. I am not close to your level of cleanliness when it comes to hand made mods.

Thanks for your suggestions, Romans. Have a look at the pic to see if this is what you meant?



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knovikov


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Location: ohio

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Posts: 318

RE: Turbo Bug Bites
05/23/15 10:20 AM

Last night ordered a partial "water-meth" kit to get me started. The cooling effect, as well as other benefits in running the turbo make it a necessity. The turbo generates a lot of heat and I always shut down the motor if the bike is at a long stop light. Never felt the single fan did much good. Also moved my radiator 1" closer to the wheel and away from the heat of the turbos.

The progressive solenoid is rated at 300 psi and the spray nozzle is rated at 1 GPH.

Still need to figure out when to spray, where to spray, and how much to spray - think I need to pray..I mean spray.

Was thinking about OEM swingarm as a holding tank for the water/meth mix. Dont know if this was how you set up your system Romans. Could not find a cross-section of the swingarm anywhere, but there are 2 big holes and a few smaller holes for brackets. The volume of the swingarm should hold quite a bit of fluid. Since swingarm is AL dont think there will be an adverse effect with a 50/50 water meth mix. In the picture you can see a big hole, with another just like it on the opposite side.

Please let me know your thoughts.


* Last updated by: knovikov on 5/23/2015 @ 10:21 AM *



Accept the invitation to a journey of your evolution both spiritual and cultural as illustrated by Rook's hairy ass.

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