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Thread: Class

Created on: 04/22/13 10:53 PM

Replies: 51

ItsPaul


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Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

Class
04/22/13 10:53 PM

Well, after 19 years of winging it on and off with all kinds of bikes..
I'm taking my first track day/ instructional class.. "CLASS" at Streets of Willow on Friday.
Really looking forward to it. Excited to learn the right way to do things and deserve the bike I'm on.
None of my friends or riding buddies have bad any formal training either so this will hopefully be an eye opener and help me stay safe during my daily 40 mile commuting.
Stepped up the bike, stepping up the gear.. Riding a lot more than the past and now time to hopefully step up myself.
Anyways.. Just excited and wanted to share....



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

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Rook


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Posts: 20590

RE: Class
04/23/13 7:54 AM

"instructional class"

You WILL be going faster than you ever dreamed of on the streets. It is so much easier and safer!!! have fun. You will learn SO much. Get ready to start a track day fund.



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE Now Deceased

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ItsPaul


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Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

RE: Class
04/23/13 10:10 AM

Yes... Can't wait!.. And yes... Now that I bit the bullet with all the gear I am already planning on going again the next class after I replace my tires again :)..
I hope to make a casual habit of it...



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

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Maddevill


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Location: Hayward, CA

Joined: 04/23/11

Posts: 2658

RE: Class
04/23/13 2:57 PM

You will LOVE it!!! Racing, for me, made me so much safer on the street. I took my aggressions out at the track so I was much mellower on the road. Now I do occasional track days to stay sharp. I'm taking my son for his first track day this August too.

Mad



Owner of KNGKAW.

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cruderudy


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Location: AMR

Joined: 08/15/12

Posts: 1963

RE: Class
04/23/13 8:30 PM

I did Streets last year and had a great time, The 14 is a bit big for that track but I did ok and I had fun, the 600 and liter bikes will be flying by u. Hopefully u signed up for the entry level group 1 class so there is no pressure to go faster than your limit, you are going to love the "bowl Turn"

Last week I got on Auto club Speedway in Fontucky CA, the 2.3 mile 21 turn AMA track, that track is made for the 14. I hit 150+ on the straight all day long, really grew to trust the breaks, Fasttrackriders http://www.fastrackriders.com/ is running another Friday session on May 17 for $179 its way more fun that streets of willow and faster and safer. Let me know if you're interested we can hook up, plus u get to use the pit garages the NASCAR racers use very nice facilities. Best time I manage was 2;07 UPPER HALF OF THE GROUP 1

Rich



Perfectly Set up '06 dead and gone
New BBW '14 14R

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ItsPaul


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Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

RE: Class
04/23/13 8:37 PM

Nice!!.. I am pretty timid in turns and hope to unlearn bad habits and get some pointers and gain a little confidence in what a sport bike can comfortably do... I assume ill be one of the slower of the group and I did specify the B group as well.
That sounds like a great time and 179 sounds very reasonable.. I will definitely let you know if I end up going that way. Thanks for the info. If I make my chicken strips a little smaller ill be happy.. No rush.. Just hoping to turn a corner and start improving.



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

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Rook


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Joined: 03/28/09

Posts: 20590

RE: Class
04/23/13 10:03 PM

If I make my chicken strips a little smaller ill be happy..

run your tires at 28 psi front and back. If it's warm weather by you you will be amazed at what happens after your first session. By the second or third session you may have no chicken strips.

I have never worn a tire to the edge on the street. On the track in summer with a Bt003 at 28 psi, they're gone, at least on the back. The tire softened up to a sticky gumball.

I was disappointed with my track day last year. Early in the season, it is still too cold to corner hard. I left the track with chicken strips pretty close to what I have on the street. It was not worth the $250 to ride that day. There were just as many riders on the track as in Summer too so no advantage there either. I training day would have been better for me.



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE Now Deceased

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Hub


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Joined: 02/05/09

Posts: 13719

RE: Class
04/23/13 10:05 PM

The old man can move. I'd like to go after him wit diss bike. And no pussy bar guards on the brake levers tell him. LOL

Someone wet down the track with oil first. Then I'm good to go.



Tormenting the motorcycling community one post at a time

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Hub


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Posts: 13719

RE: Class
04/23/13 10:20 PM

I have his book and it's basic level. I think the word is 'smooth' is you might hear that a lot if not from him, then me is just the basics. That and look way out ahead is where the smoothing comes in. When you go to work or whatever, watch yourself look at the nose of the car and that more or less tells you how far you were looking out.

So the scare tactic is to look way out but how far? And there is where your timing begins. Keith has a better program and I'm looking at it objectively. Keith has drills. Those basics are combined but dissected. The other class structures are more basic driven say.

There is just way too much to learn, so much you'll suck in. Grasp what you can. Apply it to your driving/riding time or lose it.



Tormenting the motorcycling community one post at a time

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Rook


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Joined: 03/28/09

Posts: 20590

RE: Class
04/23/13 10:22 PM

Your humility will be an asset to you Paul.. People crashed at both of the track days I did on the 14. There were crashes in the Novis group(that's what I choose to ride in) and the pro group. People get caught up and push too hard. I guess everyone has to decide at which point they are willing to accept the consequences of a race track crash. The rider is usually uninjured but the bike is ALWAYS a horrible mess. Pieces everywhere. Well, you don't want that with your pristine street bike. Maybe some day with your track beater. I almost bought it with my 14 at my first track day. I ended up in the grass but I didn't go down. Thank God BHF has HUGE runoff areas. different video than thi sone...I'll post if you want to see.

But just check this out from 4:40. You'll see what it looks like.



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE Now Deceased

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ItsPaul


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Location:

Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

RE: Class
04/23/13 10:42 PM

All in all I am not interested in being a hero or damaging my beautiful bike.. I already understand why people have track bikes and I haven't even gone yet!.. Lol.. I don't think ill get much scrubbed off the tires at the class or on the street.. Just hoping to get some fundamentals to work on and am lucky enough to be near Mulholland Hwy and hundreds of other nice windy canyon roads.. Most of which are empty on week nights and can be a great place for me to sneak up on more aggressive riding.. Drooling right now waiting for Friday to see what good information and help I will have at my disposal for a few hours...
Thanks for all the tips, facts and encouragement!... i feel this class will be a huge step in the right direction for more fun, safer riding.
I ride 40 miles a day now and can stretch that out a bit on the canyon detours on my way home from work.



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

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ItsPaul


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Location:

Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

RE: Class
04/24/13 6:09 AM

I have the book "Twist of the wrist 2"... Just started reading it last week and haven't gotten too far into it.
Any better books out there to read?.. This book was given to me.
Or videos?...
Rook... Was the guy who layed his bike down hurt?..



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

Link | Top | Bottom

Rook


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Joined: 03/28/09

Posts: 20590

RE: Class
04/24/13 7:21 AM

Was the guy who layed his bike down hurt?..

No. He is seen walking away off the track in the vid at 5:17. He is hard to see because of the wide angle lens.

The Expert rider I know crashed his ZX-10 last year and he was also fine. You can ride within your limits on the track but some people want to push right up to the line. There will be safety rules in the lower skill groups that are more limiting as far as passing is concerned. It's really not limiting to me to not be permitted to pass in a corner on the inside or the outside. to me that is just common sense, not a limitation...but that's me. Some riders feel like they need to rise into a higher class.

One thing that sucks is that the smaller bike swill not be able to keep up with you on the straightaways if you give it all the 14 has. Then they will catch up to you and not be able to pass you in the corner. That really pisses people off. AFAIC, it's just a prejudice against the larger bike. If I was on a really fast 600 and I passed everyone on the straightaways to get to open track for the corners, no one would have anything to say about it. I still held back at the straightaways to let people pass easily if they wanted...which kind of ruined it for me but share and share alike....

You can see I am not exactly redlining it as I hit the long back straightaway where that guy races me. I still pulled out in front of him until I let off the throttle. We were coming up on the riders ahead of us who were slowing for turn #1. Although I would have been in a much better track position to take that corner at high speed(it's a doozy), I just had less braking distance than the other guy because of the person in front of me. I also was fairly certain that the person in front of me had no idea that I was there or that there was any competition going on so I gave up where I felt my safety zone was about at its limit.



'08 MIDNIGHT SAPPHIRE BLUE Now Deceased

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ItsPaul


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Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

RE: Class
04/24/13 7:54 AM

Ok.. Yes I did notice that you were more "cruising" down some of the straights.
As you said I believe the rules are just the same with this class.. There's only passing on the two straights but I don't really want to be a bottle neck for everyone in the turns so I will try and chill down the straights too.
HAVE to give it a good go here and there to get it out if my system.
The freeway On-ramps are my favorite place lately but getting to 100 mph but 100 come wayyy too fast on this bike.. lol..I hope everyone in the B group today just wants to learn something and have a good time.. That's my plan at least. Weather is supposed to be 82 degrees and dry with little wind.. Looking pretty good.



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

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Maddevill


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Location: Hayward, CA

Joined: 04/23/11

Posts: 2658

RE: Class
04/24/13 11:16 AM

great place for me to sneak up on more aggressive riding.

Uh... I disagree completely. The track is THE place to sneak up on aggressive riding. The street is for "The Pace" and having a nice day. You'll see what I mean after you do your track day. Have fun!

Mad



Owner of KNGKAW.

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ItsPaul


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Location:

Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

RE: Class
04/24/13 1:32 PM

I assume taking the class and getting on a real track will be a major eye opener...
I guess I should have used "confident/faster" vs aggressive in my post but you're right.. The PUSH-IT riding definitely should be on the track... Thanks

Hey Rook.. I see you have a speedo healer on your bike.. I would love to fix the error on what speed I'm doing..
Between the factory error and my +2 rear sprocket it's pretty annoying and the miles are adding to my bike faster than should be... Does it work good?.. Is that even why you have it installed?



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

Link | Top | Bottom

Hub


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Joined: 02/05/09

Posts: 13719

RE: Class
04/24/13 2:09 PM

Paul, the sprockets are adding more speedo is because the engine is revving more and moving with less feet, yes, but the engine speed equaled the mileage, so it is sort of deceiving as you mentioned, but the reality is still counted as hours.

If you want less time on the engine, use less throttle blips, less running at lights is that idle time. Anyway, here are a few things you'll encounter to have an easier day of it.

1. Vision ~ You'll hear it over and over. You want smooth, look way out ahead so you can see the bend coming.
2. Timing ~ It's all about timing and it takes time to build up to speed. You'll know you are out of time when your throttle transitions are not smooth. You will go to yourself, I could have gone deeper, but my timing is off. I come around next time and learn from this backing off, because I missed my timing to brake, time to turn, time to lift it up, time to accelerate but you won't be thinking like that. It's what you will automatically do without thinking. You'll more see how speed changes things.
3. Speed ~ Street speed and race speeds are two different animals. Your race speed elevates your street speed. You become more confident street wise. Your brake timing will change. You'll begin to understand deep braking = Timing.
4. Smoothing ~ The creme de la creme that brings it all together. Racing demands smooth. There are less mistakes being smooth. This makes your timing more fluid. The smoothing builds more speed like you wouldn't believe. It makes your throttle action slow down. You are not on and off on the throttle anymore. It sets the timing. So you know when to back off of the speed. I have no clue how Reg runs the show? I like the Keith drills, because he forces you to run the ideal line by hitting the taped X's all along the track. He shows you how to be smooth by not using the brakes. That brings that timing back to the basics.

Both have their different styles of teaching. The apex is more the art. Watch any F1 driver and one will be faster than the other. One may take a late line, short line, middle of the road line. It all depends on your style, the groove you set, or the pace you are comfortable in. You're going there with a good attitude. No hero games. No running over your head first time out. Each time you go out, the progression just keeps building.

You'll school yourself more on the basics. The more you go out, the faster you become. The bike and you really have no cap to reach. If we progressed 10 years ahead or so, someone will out pace Marquez's speed. Man has no limit and speed is relative. Only limit is who is sitting on that seat?



Tormenting the motorcycling community one post at a time

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cruderudy


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Location: AMR

Joined: 08/15/12

Posts: 1963

RE: Class
04/24/13 3:52 PM

Paul,

I've got 2 books from Amazon on riding I love and read over and over: one is Sport Riding Techniques by Nick "The Pace" Ienatsch and the other is really a "heady" grad level book, The Upper Half of the Motorcycle by Bernt Spiegle. I really like Spiegle's book, it's a hard read and I had to reread most sections several times before I got it but its really interesting. His main theme is integrating the rider into the bike so you can "feel" the contact patch. Hard to explain but great book



Perfectly Set up '06 dead and gone
New BBW '14 14R

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ItsPaul


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Location:

Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

RE: Class
04/24/13 4:23 PM

All right then Rudy.. thanks.. Looks like I've got some reading material to get a hold of.
Will maybe grab the first book now and start there.

Hub.. I actually did think about the mileage being what it says really due to the drivetrain (mostly motor) is still doing the work that would have propelled it the speed indicated..
But at the same time I just wish ONE of my vehicles would just tell me how fast I'm really going. Just a pet peeve of mine. May just have to tape my phone to the tank and watch the GPS speed for a few common speed limits and figure out the error.
Will re read your tips above a few times and try to get them to sink in.. Good info.. Thanks!



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

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dericrey


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Location: Vidor, Texas

Joined: 04/04/12

Posts: 256

RE: Class
04/24/13 7:31 PM

Paul,
First I have to say good luck and have fun. I am completely jealous. I have been looking around for a track close enough to me to do the same for the same reasons. Please keep us updated on your experience. I am excited for you.



2009 ZX-14
Semper Fidelis
Kill 'em all, let God sort 'em out.
Violence Solves Everything.

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ItsPaul


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Location:

Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

RE: Class
04/24/13 10:15 PM

Thanks... Will definitely post my experience!..



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

Link | Top | Bottom

ItsPaul


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Location:

Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

RE: Class
04/26/13 8:38 PM

WOOOOOWEEEEEE Was that fun!... Just got home.. 100 miles each way plus the class made for a 14 hour day but so worth it!!... I should have done this years ago!... I would definitely describe my abilities before the class as safe but timid... Never worn my tires to the edge.. By the end of the second 20 minute session I was down to a 1/4" on both sides... And I'm so much more comfortable turning right than before. All I can say is all the good things you guys said is more than true!.. Pretty impressed with the Pilot Road 3's that I chose for a high mileage and capable tire.
Already thinking about the next class.
Awesome awesome awesome... Not taking a sport bike to a track is like never leaving the parking lot with a Vette.. Never knew what I was missing... And I'm sure I'm barely scratching the surface on what the 14 is capable of.
All in all... GREAT DAY!



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

Link | Top | Bottom

dericrey


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Location: Vidor, Texas

Joined: 04/04/12

Posts: 256

RE: Class
04/26/13 10:21 PM

Dang, that makes me want to find a track even more than ever!



2009 ZX-14
Semper Fidelis
Kill 'em all, let God sort 'em out.
Violence Solves Everything.

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ItsPaul


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Location:

Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

RE: Class
04/27/13 12:11 PM

One of the days pics... A little earlier in the day than I'd like the pics taken but still came out ok I think



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

Link | Top | Bottom

ItsPaul


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Location:

Ventura County Ca

Joined: 03/03/13

Posts: 103

RE: Class
04/27/13 4:08 PM

Rook.. Totally got what you said about the straightaways and how if I gave it much no one could pass me where allowed. So I took what you said and held back a few times.. Sure enough almost every time was a faster rider in the turns waiting to pass. Don't know if they appreciate or realized what i did but I'm sure it made their track time better.. Thanks for the tip.

I probably got no where near where the bike could comfortably lean but it sure felt like I was far over and you nailed it.. 2nd session the strips were about gone....



2008 ZX-14 sold last december to consolidate debt... Miss the hell out of it...
Rest are sold....
2011 Vrod
1999 Hayabusa
2013 CRF 250L
2001 Vespa 150
2007 SV 650s
1956 Vespa VL3
1998 FZR600
2007 CBR600rr
1986 GSXR 1100
1992 Katana 600
1986 Ninja 600r

Link | Top | Bottom


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