Hi there, my ZX14 cuts out as soon as the plug leading from the voltage regulator to battery is plugged in? I have replaced the voltage regulator and the stator has been checked and is satisfactory. Any ideas where to start looking please? without this plug the bike runs fine.

* Last updated by: ZX14pierre on 8/19/2018 @ 11:39 AM *

Remove ground from frame. Connect the v-reg. Tap the ground and note spark. Remove seat. Remove and replace one fuse at a time where no spark occurs when grounding the cable to the frame. Report findings... [yeah right]

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Thx for info, will report back as soon as possible. Do I need to do this with ignition switched on, or bike running? New to the forum so still finding my way around.

* Last updated by: ZX14pierre on 8/20/2018 @ 4:37 AM *

Key on only. You're looking for a short to ground. A tiny white/blue/orange spike is the clock always needing E to stay timed, plus the key being on, the small arc has the ECU going hot and now the taillight. So those combined will spike an ever so small sparkle. A direct short, a blue/white arc is huge, will eat the ground eyelet on the spike. That's a direct short. Pull the fuses, the huge arc stops, then it's back to the clock's mini arc, taillight too if the fuse to the T/L is still in the loop. This way you know there's something in the wire harness via the fuse routing.

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I have done the procedure as recommended, I removed the fuses one by one and earthed the wire to chassis as requested the "SPARK" Seems the same for all the different fuses? it seems like a normal spark(not bright) I am mechanically minded, so the electrical bit is a bit of a headache for me. Thx for the info so far, I really appreciate the help

* Last updated by: ZX14pierre on 8/21/2018 @ 3:21 AM *

The 3 yellow wires going into the volt/reg, we are saying:
1. I set the the ohm meter to infinity, hold one yellow wire and prong the other two yellows individually, they all swing the meter to infinity, or zero out digitally.
2. I hold the neg lead of the meter to the bike's ground somewhere. I prong the 3 yellow wires individually and the needle does not swing when touching with the posi lead of the meter; nor does the digital move as if I am holding out the leads in the air>> no touch.
3. I bought a new vo/rg not used, right?

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test 1, meter zeros out digitally
test 2 Meter does not change art all (as if holding leads in the air)

Yes I purchased a new vo/rg

I did all the tests for stator output as well. all specs as per manual
the vo/rg output is approximately 14.7V at 4000 Rpm as measured directly at the vo/rg pins

without the vo/rg output plug connected, the bike revs freely,as soon as I connect the plug the bike dies immediately.

I had the bike at a local Kawasaki dealer a while ago and they recommended replacing complete harness and Instrument cluster!! At a cost of R24 000 (South African Rand) that is approx. $1600. I decided to rather bring the bike home.

The one thing I do find strange is that when I turn the ignition to on the headlight is illuminated? I am sure it used to only come on once the bike has started?

Those sit in the nose. Might be 2? They are interchangeable. Do this now. Remove both at their connectors. You might have to remove the screen to get to them, not sure. Either way, connect the vo/rg back up. Start the bike. Plug in one relay at a time. If the one reconnected keeps the bike running, it's not it. If you connect the next one and it stalls the bike, get it?

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Those sit in the nose. Might be 2?

Are you referring to the headlight relays?

according to what I have told you thus far, do you think the vo/rg is fine?

The following was the report from the dealer

Report as per your request.

Regulator rectifier faulty pushed ac current through system (bikes run on dc current)
Regulator is an electrical item that can fail at any time or due to normal wear.
Harness needs to be replaced.
Stator is in good working order.

Kind Regards,

You said:

my ZX14 cuts out as soon as the plug leading from the voltage regulator to battery is plugged in?

What made you remove the v/r from the stator, then find out it runs unplugged, yes?

You said:

I have replaced the voltage regulator and the stator has been checked and is satisfactory.

Who concluded it was the v/r and why will the new one shut the bike off. This is a new v/r right? And where is the old one to plug back in and see if this was not misdiagnosed or watt?

You said:

without this plug the bike runs fine.

WATT you're telling me is that if you unplug the yellow wires from the NEW v/r, the bike runs just off the battery, right? Because you broke the loop of the 2 other components. Stator is AC. V/R means the V coverts to DC. Reg says it regulated the 14.6v dash reading when all 3 are connected.

With bike running, no matter the rev, the volts in the dash remain the same of not losing voltage running at a 'total loss' of the battery voltage.

Key on, headlight on means a sticking relay. The relays are hung on their own rubber pouches. They hang on the metal brace bar. Again, as things pop in my head, I could keep just the key on and low and behold the headlight is on. I just remove on relay connector at a time to see who shuts off the light. I plug the bad one in it should light the headlight back up. I plug the other one in alone and it does nothing, sort of see the engine off relay guessing game?

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Regulator rectifier faulty pushed ac current through system (bikes run on dc current)

Are you saying that since the v/r failed, the AC took the shortest path and traveled to the battery and you could smell a sulfur kind of overheated battery? That's a yes, is why I suspected the v/r failure or, no, I ran the battery down with nothing unconnected.

Regulator is an electrical item that can fail at any time or due to normal wear.

Electrics fail due to heat. One part on the motherboard fails, it shorts or say the bridge is out and no traffic flow to complete a circle that can flow in either direction say. So if no conversion to regulate 14v to the battery, it was the full AC to the battery... goes stink. Say we use a harley 32 amp stator. 16+16 = 32. Half the turn of the engine says N pole. The other side of the stator says S pole. That's 16v every 180° of the engine spin. The v/r capture each 16v of AC pulse. The reg only drops 1.?v to ground we do the math of 16v.
14.2v or better = Good system no failed/burnt stator/vo-reg.
16v DC at the (+)battery posts(-) = Good stator, bad vo/reg.

[q]Harness needs to be replaced.[q]
Doubt it. Bad harness is twofold. Wire break inside the harness, or direct short. Everything works, right? No blown fuses, right? Take another guess. Only your relay knows for sure.

Stator is in good working order.

Did the shop start the bike, meter the yellow wire outputs and where they equal at each yellow wire? Yes or no?

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Maybe I should start at the beginning to clarify,

I had an accident with the bike, only cosmetic damage.
The bike was repaired by a Kawasaki dealer and I got it back and it was running fine. About two weeks after getting it back it would cut out and die every now and again. Then it just wouldnt fire up at all. I took it back to the dealer. they said it was the cam position sensor causing the problem (as per fault code reading). The cam position sensor was replaced but the bike still would not fire up.

The dealer then started looking for the problem and informed me that it was due to the AC being delivered to the battery due to bad vo/rg. They had disconnected the one plug (not the 3 yellow wires)from the vo/rg to show me that the bike runs fine, and said that I should replace the vo/rg and harness. They also ran the bike and checked the stator output, and all three yellow wires were in the same range.

So it is the plug from the vo/rg that has two wires leading to the 30A Fuse/relay connection below rear of tank that is removed. then the bike runs fine. The dealer actually showed me that by removing this plug the bike is okay.

There was no sulphur smell or signs of overheating
There are no blown fuses
everything else works fine when plug leading from vo/rg to 30A fuse/relay is removed.

I took the bike home and proceeded to replace the vo/rg and the battery as a precautionary measure.

plugged the 3 yellow wire plug into the vo/rg and bike starts and runs fine. I switch the bike off refit the other plug to the vo/rg and then bike doesn't fire up at all.

no difference between old and new vo/rg.

Checked this afternoon I can remove either of the plugs on vo/rg and bike runs fine. If both plugs are connected at the same time the bike dies.

Stator output approximately 75V @r4000 RPM (this is between all of the pins)

vo/rg output measured directly at the regulator with plug removed 15.4V DC.(4000 RPM)

with ignition switched on and engine not running dim and bright headlights are working. When I remove the relays the specific light dies dim or bright. As soon as the bike starts (with either plug removed from the vo/rg) the headlight dies

Would an excessive voltage output (for eg. 16v DC)from vo/rg be able to cause the cut out? or would it just be harmful to the battery?

Could the starter relay be a cause?

Thanks for your patience

* Last updated by: ZX14pierre on 8/22/2018 @ 10:14 AM *

Hey, this keeps me from forgetting WATT little I know. You learn, I learn... if you ever figure it out and explain the hindsight found. Withatsaid, WATT do you think is going on here? New info. A crash = A Pinch in the harness?

Since the crash, we are somewhere in a hot wire pinch, correct? The steps are: key on, relay goes hot, headlight goes on, engine is off. I'm going to assume this is the scenario right now. The crash brings on a whole different bag of tricks. The harness routing is so complicated in the trace, this becomes a lot easier looking for this crash gash.

How extensive was the crash and how much was changed, who reinstalled the parts and, oh shit, I didn't see me pinch the harness and oopsees the pinch now says to look at the crash site. Who's side crashed? I'd start there. First I'd be real careful not to upset anything short of disturbing the harness. So even removing the plastic, you are looking for something torn on the harness covering. I think it goes something like this:
1. I'm going to look visually as far left as I can to see said harness routing. Be it the big boy or the sub-harness's and where they lay. I have to take tiny centimeter jumps with the eyes. This still is a working, oops, there it is?
2. After the section has past the visual [can't find], this is now the pull away idea. The pinch is on the loose, so the pull away returns back to the left side starting place. A simple lift from the bottom has to show travel. It's the simple moves chasing this down.
3. The obvious areas of interest is to concentrate at the crash points. This final one is to twist the harness areas you can't see. The visual didn't show. The lift away didn't show. This twist to find out if the pinch was so severe, it bit thru both wires and connected the relay wire to said hot wire, so as to trigger the headlight to remain on with key only. This says, the repair was made, the pinch was disturbed, the wires are still touching, etc. WATT are the odds, who knows?

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Hey there, I suppose I was supposed to mention the crash.

I swerved to miss a Taxi that did a U-turn without indicating before sunrise. Bike came down on left hand side and slid on the left hand side (no flip over) The left hand generator cover (stator cover) was the only major mechanical part replaced due to grazing. The rest was all cosmetic damage. However all the fairings were removed as the complete bike was resprayed. New exhausts were fitted as the left hand exhaust was also scratched. I had the sparkplugs replaced by the dealer while all the fairings were removed.

I hope I have now given all the facts. I have removed the majority of the fairings/plastic bits at this stage to see if I can see any visual damage.

Once again. thanks for the guidance

Left side = Dyno Side.

The yellows connected>> the bike runs.
The other connector goes into the v/r>> the bike shuts off.
That's the scenario, right?

WATT are the odds the dyno cover harness is pinched? Someone took it off and replaced it. Now the question is, was this scenario before the crash or after the crash you started swapping the v/reg?

* Last updated by: Hub on 8/22/2018 @ 8:42 PM *

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Yes the yellow wires go into connector and then into vo/rg and the bike runs (vo/rg input)
The bike dies when other conector is plugged into the vo/rg (vo/rg output)

This started after the bike was accident repaired

The vo/rg was replaced when the bike started acting up after repair damamge.

Stupid question? why no fuses blown?

* Last updated by: ZX14pierre on 8/23/2018 @ 5:41 AM *

The why no fuse blown theory... good question. My only retort is my electrical toolbox theory I go by:
"Magnetism ~ You cannot separate the heat from the chemical reaction."

Takes heat to keep the battery acid mixed-in with the water. That's chemical reaction + heat, right?
Takes heat to form the white acid powder onto the negative battery post and cable being a chemRe, right?

Now the hard part ~ in theory. I'm going on a hunch about 'resistance.' By that I mean the metal used as a heat-sink. I then apply heat to the theory. The engine case is the heat-sink, the pinched (+)wire has maybe one strand or two in the pinch scenario; that there is that much heat off the strand(s) to [here's the follow-thru] bleed off that resistance as it grounds. The rest of the strands still travel and said fuse does not have enough push {friction on the move} to heat the band to melt and break. The frame/engine pinch is the heat reducer of this... Idea.

My mistake. I was thinking there was electro-magnetism (+)triggering going on at the stator. I now see only 3-yellows out of the cover only. I thought there were more wires at that area. I led the both of us on a goosee. And that too says installing those into the v/r keeps the bike running. So we are back to the fat white wire at the output side. The blk/y is the ground, aka, sends the excess thru this heavy gauge too. So white heavy travels to the (+) side of the battery, then T's off to the key switch.

This is now battery ground removed from frame. We want the ohm meter set to infinity. When we plug the heavy into the v/r, kill is grounded and the bike stops let's say. White is hot to the key side. If I probe white-heavy to blk/y-heavy, I don't want the meter to move, meaning, as if both probes are in the air away from each other. If heavy-white reads touching heavy-blk/y = Kill engine to ground.

Both should not touch in their respective loops. White-heavy is it's own wire and runs to the battery(+) feeding the battery back up. White-light gauge T's off to the key switch. So by disconnecting the key connection, probe the white wire at the end of the connector and hit the neg probe to ground first. No reading should occur.

Where are we at now? Apologies me at the memory rather than looking things up in the book.

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I will need to print that out as I will have to read that numerous times to understand and apply(haha) I am an aircraft ground engineer by trade (mechanical) so my knowledge of electrical is very basic. I am trying to follow and do everything That you have told me and am learning so much from your online tuition, for which I am extremely grateful. I will get down to doing the tests on Saturday and will report my findings.

so I need to have (1)ground removed from frame
(2)Three yellows plugged into VR/RG
(3)White & blk/y plugged into the VO/RG
(4)then check if White & blk/y are short circuiting?

In case you missed a point I made earlier, I checked last night that if any one of the connectors on the vo/reg is removed the bike runs well, as soon as they are both connected it refuses to start/run.

Once again, thanks for your patience and guidance it is truly appreciated.

I will report back on Saturday. I am not sure how to upload a photo on the forum if need be to make myself clearer.

1. Why you need to have the ground removed from frame is to look at it as having no battery in the loop. You'll short the meter if there is battery current to the meter. Only time you're safe is when the meter is set to DCV. Plus, we are reading each part as a chain from one end to the other. So white from the v/r runs down to the battery(+) side. I'll [bracket] the jobber's name, then run a wire ______ to the next jobber's name. Then watch how many jobbers I found that are not grounded, plus, we have 3 simple 'white' wire ends we are tracing to ground, or to each other. I'm going to make sure that I probe the W-heavy from end to end and, so I need the key switch connector removed so the T-wires are free from touching ground and/or their remote jobber being the key switch:

Probe(+) To>[v/r connector female prong W-heavy wire]______[30a fuse assy]_____[Battery cable post with posi(+)cable still connected to battery]<Probe(-)... With the meter to infinity it should swing as if both probes are touching each other. This is called a 'complete circuit.' All you did was act like you picked up a foot of bare wire and touched both ends with the meter to see if there is a break somewhere in the wire? So you just checked the integrity of the female prong to wire end; the integrity to the fuse holder on the one side; the integrity of the connector there on that wire end; the fuse is not blown so there is more integrity down the wire route and jumps from one jobber to the other showing good (no short to ground)... right to the end at the posi cable that feeds the DC to replenish the draw of current out of the battery. We are not done with the probe.

Final probe of that wire is to see if it's shorted to ground but I kind of doubt it. We lift the (-)probe off the battery(+) cable that we stuck the needle up the battery boot and made contact on the first loop> Now we ground the neg probe to see if W-heavy shorts to ground. So if this meter moves from W-heavy to engine or the frame's ground... it shouldn't move. Don't go near the battery ground cable with W-heavy or you'll spike the meter and render it useless. But with the battery cable away hanging in the air, then no meter failure... circuit is not complete. This is how you can see if a hot wire is short to ground? The blown fuse kind that is. With battery ground connected, W-heavy becomes hot on its own.

W-heavy is a direct (+) wire in the reverse remember. It's hooked up to the posi battery post. Infinity is more for wire end to wire end breaks. DCV is to see if 12v is to the key switch off of W-light wire and any other wire that is hot like the horn wire... with key on that is.

(2)Three yellows plugged into VR/RG and they are AC IN and both of the pulses are captured of that one yellow, as a one way switch inside the v/r prevents reversion. So for every action, it captures this and the reaction. But theory says, for every action is an opposite so yeah it (AC) does, but the one way diode says another. It's all the sub-theories making it all make some sort of easy sense to it and complex at the same time.

(3)White & blk/y plugged into the VO/RG is how the high AC input has to be stepped down is the 1.? volts to ground and in the constant discharge to ground. Thus the thicker wire to cool the heat. The 14/?v is sent down W-heavy to the battery(+) side. More rpm the more output of the AC. E is linear. So it starts at 0123456v and so on until the said (5,000) rpm peaks at said yellow output wire is within the book's spec number.
(4)then check if White & blk/y are short circuiting to see if ground triggers hot? So both have to read infinity on their own, and if you switch probes and the seem connected by the meter's needle swing or digital number of 0 or infinity completing a loop, then W-heavy and blk/y are pinched together and/or a jobber is stuck like a relay, where the relay wires are tied to the kick stand safety switch = KILLS Engine/starts engine, meaning is junk or works.

In case you missed a point I made earlier, I checked last night that if any one of the connectors on the vo/reg is removed the bike runs well, as soon as they are both connected it refuses to start/run.

This is basic abstract right out of the book. I'll paraphrase, but it still is too simple to understand:

1. Wire out of Connector.
It's not this troubleshoot of the troubletree. We know the connectors are connected. That says the wires are to their jobbers at both wire ends. So the bulb lights for example.
2. Connector not connected.
This too is not somewhere to look because this too obviously shows the light bulb is connected.
3. Wire short to ground.
There are no other variables, right? This here in the diagnosing of said electrical issue is when it is plugged in, be it the wire or connector, the bike cuts out or shorts out is ding-ding-ding, we narrowed it down.

Starter Relay:
a. W-heavy leave v/r and down to starter relay.
b. Relay's other heavy cable post end is the (+)side cable to battery.
c. W-heavy from v/r is not needed, because battery cable side is hot to the relay so the bike starts and runs.
d. Plug in W-heavy from the v/r side to the opposite side of the starter relay.
e. W-light wire exits the starter relay to key switch.
f. Starter loop triggers kick stand safety switch and this wire comes out of the starter relay.
g. Starter relay has said wire coming out of relay to see if kicker is up or down. The gear position sensor also is in the loop for N to be the maker/breaker for the start with kick up or down, right?
h. Shit, I'm already down to here thinking it out and now the yellows stop the engine only without white heavy being plugged in.

That's some weird shit. So let me ask this. Start the bike without yellow and heavy connected. Where is the headlight now with key on only. That means, no v/r connected, no engine running. Say key on, headlight on = Starter relay(?) Why? Because if the headlight is on with key on only, you haven't mentioned this part of the diagnosing to see if the relay is stuck on,ie, the h/l is on. It needs to be hot yes, we know this, but the starter button keeps the light off and the relay keeps it on once the button is depressed. So say the relay is stuck on if the h/l comes on.

And one more way to approach it. You'll have to get a very powerful jeweler's loop or magnifier to see and depress the lock tab to the v/r's connector ends. Hand file a nail so it's flat and narrow. Find the tab direction and you slip the nail blade under, so the tab moves up and out of the plastic locking wall; call it. Then pull to at the same time, once you have a tab in the bend going that is. Say you have all 5 wires loose and out of their connectors. Install one yellow at a time as the bike is running. Do not touch or bump the yellow ends while running. Use needle nose and tape the end so the accidental touch is saved. One of those has to cut the engine off, right? I'd more mess with the W-heavy and ground wires and plug those in first... one at a time of course so as to see who shorted out the running. Do not remove once in. Just keep feeding. To, you could make wire connectors if you rather not butcher the connector ends trying. Match male/female ends and buy those so they are your single jumper wire. Makes it a lot easier.

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you haven't mentioned this part of the diagnosing to see if the relay is stuck on,ie, the h/l is on. It needs to be hot yes, we know this, but the starter button keeps the light off and the relay keeps it on once the button is depressed. So say the relay is stuck on if the h/l comes on.

this is what I replied regarding the headlights "with ignition switched on and engine not running dim and bright headlights are working. When I remove the relays the specific light dies dim or bright. As soon as the bike starts (with either plug removed from the vo/rg) the headlight dies"

"with ignition switched on and engine not running dim and bright headlights are working. When I remove the relays the specific light dies dim or bright. As soon as the bike starts (with either plug removed from the vo/rg) the headlight dies"

No issue:
Yellow and heavy connected to v/r.
Key on - H/L off.
Bike starts.
H/L turns on.
Bike stays running.

Current issue:
Yellow and heavy not connected to v/r.
Key on - H/L on.
Bike starts.

Another apology on the runaround. Here I'm thinking the headlight relays on the chase, and now I'm on the jobber that is closer in flow to the W-heavy's connector. Therefore, we have another relay and that is the starter relay. Starter button has to ground and hot the starter relay, right? Think of the flashlight battery, a wire wrapped around the nail, touch both wires to said D-battery and the coiled nail becomes a magnet. So starter button connects to ground. This hots the coil, magnetically pulls a spring'd arm and hots another leg out of the relay, and now this jobber lights up, starts up, etc.

So say we think this out:
1. I have no blown fuse. There is no short to ground.
2. I have a heavy that takes a lot of heat and it is not cooked or blackened at the prong ends or overheated wire covering all black and wrinkled there too. Wire harness looks normal so no heat backing up and concentrating at one location point.
3. I have no codes but the cam sensor? Possible phantom code? ECU is still hot to process data. ECU does not know if you pulled wires off the tail, head, starter, etc. Without getting into sensors, lets say the bike still runs so it's not the cam sensor. A part was thrown at it, right? So there was no change. Either way, bike runs.
4. I have eliminated the first 2 variables in the troubletree. TT-3 says; it is short to ground, or signal out of range. There is no short say the wires. There are no codes [but a saved code during this on/off session] and the bike runs so this is not a signal out of range or no start, right? ECU hot, cam spun how many times spitting blanks up the cam sensor wire to trigger the ECU code? 1 came revolution. At the speed of light no sig on the initial shutoff. Pop goes the phantom code.<<< My guess as I walk it out.
5. I wonder if you agree it might be a jobber we are missing in the loop? I ran through this list and say it's not the headlight relays, but the starter relay? Fuck, I'm walking it out and now I'm stumped again. You said in the paraphrase, "yellow only reinstalled and the bike cuts out.' Where is that in the relay then?

Let's begin one more time. Hook up the headlight relays. Hook up the yellow and heavy back in the v/r. Install the battery ground cable back up. We want to eliminate the starter relay. It either is stuck or not.
a. With all connected; are the H/L's on with key on only? Yes. Then it's the starter relay. I have the test for that to make sure it's this jobber.
b. With all still connected; are the headlights on with key only? No. Then the starter relay is not mechanically locked. Magnetically locked, it's working. That's because the arm inside did spring away from their contact points. The test is: Meter set to DCV. At the heavy leg posts, the meter is waiting to see 12v when the battery is connected to the 2 of 4 connector slots. This hots the coil winding and the arm connects to the other 2 output legs I believe. Remove 12v from the relay the leg springs back. Well, if you think about it, you did the test with the keyfob. So if there are no lights, the leg is not stuck at the 2 outputs. The starter relay is OK.

The only puzzle is... yellow only and it kills.

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I Hope this makes sense

Key on Heavy W Heavy BL/y Heavy Y Heavy Y Heavy Y Bike runs
Y Y Y Y Y Y N
Y Y Y Y Y Y N
Y Y Y N N N Y
Y N Y N N N Y
Y Y N N N N Y
Y Y Y Y N N Y
Y Y Y N Y N Y
Y Y Y N N Y Y
Y Y Y Y Y N N
Y Y Y Y N Y N
Y Y Y N Y Y N
Y N N Y Y Y Y
Y N Y Y Y Y Y
Y Y N Y Y Y Y

Y= Connected
N = Not connected

this is what I found after opening suspect insulation, Why would this have happened in the first place?

This is how I repaired it temporarily

Bike starts and runs ,everything seems normal, how much heat build up should there be in this area if anything?
There are six yellow and black wires and they all are bridged together.

What would the best permanent fix be for this?