I'm still trying to decide between a ZX14R and VFR1200 (or possibly FJR) and a major hang up for me is having a chain. Not because of the maintenance (which I actually enjoy) but because on every chain driven bike I've had it seems to constantly come out of adjustment and wear prematurely while touring, and end up makeing all kinds of racket. 5-600 miles and it would be loose again.

I take annual trips to California from Colorado and pretty much every trip on my Blackbird would destroy the chain. What am I doing wrong? I don't ride that hard but I do ride at high speed for up to 14 hours a day.

I'm about to give up and get a shafty but are there 14R riders out there with chains lasting 20K, 25K+ ?? I will say Honda's have a shitty adjuster and the 14 looks like it's more efficent and easier to use.

The one bike is more a bagger. The other is more an ugly typical japanese look. Kawi's connie bagger is gear drive. Torque wise, find if the yam's beat connie's 102lbs of torque. Any bike you mentioned is a winner. Next is to sit on the most comfortable and how much bag do you want?

more like picture woe's shame on you

What am I doing wrong?

Not really sure, but it seems like something. It's either your (chain) maintenance practices or as you say, riding the bike 14 hours a day at high speeds. I'm leaning towards chain maintenance.

When I had my old bike (mid-90s) I knew way more riders at the time. Some used up chains, some didn't. We all rode similarly and often together, so differences in riding can be eliminated. Basically it seemed to me who maintained their chains well. Riders that used chain waxes (of the time) seemed to use up chains faster. I believe chain waxes/lubes have come a long way but maybe too it's your choice of wax/lube or maybe exactly your process of doing the maintenance.

BTW - if you're replacing chains often, maybe your sprockets are worn which is causing excess wear on the new chains.

* Last updated by: VicThing on 8/10/2014 @ 12:30 PM *

I've heard of modern chains lasting a very long time with no service at all, ever. How tight do you adjust your chain?

It should droop when only the weight of the bike is on the suspension. If its tight with no rider, it's TOO tight and WAYYYY TOO TIGHT with a rider. That will stretch the chain to the proper tension (or break it) and probably wear the sprockets. After the chain finds it's own proper tension, the droop might make it appear that the chain needs adjusting again so the process of over-tightenning happens again only to stretch and ware more. How hard you pull on the chain when you measure the slack can also be deceptive. I can pull an extra half inch easy if I really lay into it. I'd say two pounds of pressure is plenty.

CHAIN ADJUSTMENT

Thank you for posting. Speaking of tight, I really missed seeing that avatar........

* Last updated by: Rook on 8/10/2014 @ 1:47 PM *

That's a great link, thank you. And 2 pounds of pressure, that's good to know as well I've always wondered about that.

I always changed the sprockets with the chain and the sprockets always were fine. When putting on a new chain, there was still a tightspot, a bad one. My friend always thought the wheel hub wasn't exactly centered or ther cush was screwed up. The first chain lasted the longest and it was 6 or 7 more sets up to 60K on the bike when I sold it.

I'd hate to settle for a shafty when the 14R is the one that I want but as I mentioned, I give my chains a lot of work but certainly possible I just don't know how to tigheten the stupid thing. Has anyone here worked on a XX chain adjuster? They pretty much suck IMO and can back out & allow the axle to slip.

* Last updated by: Auron on 8/10/2014 @ 2:08 PM *

I'd hate to settle for a shafty when the 14R is the one that I want

..but as I mentioned, I give my chains a lot of work but certainly possible I just don't know how to tigheten the stupid thing. Has anyone here worked on a XX chain adjuster?

Maybe check out a scottoiler, I think that would be perfect for you.

Hmmm Scottoiler sounds like a damn good idea. I would try to lube my chain nightly but if never seemed to be enough. On those high speed days I stop only for gas and I'm thinking that chain just gets hotter and hotter. Not only that but the XX is a dog compared to the a 14R so I'm afraid it would only be worse. 700 miles non-stop at 80-90 seems like it's gonna be a problem on a bike like this.

Here's what a Honda adjuster looks like (Not my bike). Even if the alignment markings are correct, you can't see them very well, especially on the other side, where there is basically a few tiny notches in the swingarm and adjuster. Then that screw vibrates itself out and lets the axle move, loosening the chain. I recently started snugging the adjuster bolt after tightening the axle on my 919 commuter bike, but that a whole different bike and usage, seems to help. This is all assumption, feel free to school me on a most basic concept.

* Last updated by: Auron on 8/10/2014 @ 8:50 PM *

The 14 CAN'T get loose...I mean...the axle is being 'pulled' from the chain tension(against the adjuster bolts)....any looseness is happening because of chain stretch.80-90 mph drives...700(with stops)miles....lubing at 400 miles...it'll last a long time.If you suspect the rear sprocket is off alignment...look at the teeth....whattaya see?I've ALWAYS set my axle up with the hash marks looking straight through the axle.NEVER had any wear problems.Some guys say you can't depend on those marks for alignment....I don't agree at all.

You see that lower run there....measure from the plate top and raise up(underneath with fingers)....there should be approx 1"play(halfway or so along the lower run).

* Last updated by: Grn14 on 8/10/2014 @ 9:26 PM *

So what kind of shitty design is that Honda came up with?

I've not put more than 5K miles on a bike that didn't have the one like what's pictured above so I can't say for sure if that the reason but if a well looked after 14R chain with a Scottoiler is all I need then I'm stoked.

* Last updated by: Auron on 8/10/2014 @ 9:40 PM *

The XX adjuster looks nice but I can see how it might slip. Looks like the adjsuter bolt screws up against the back of the swingarm. It doesnt screw into anything. Also, IDK how strong those are. That "pull back" design was known to fail on the old Gilles adjusters made for the 14. They broke in half under the torque! Even heard a 600 breaking one. Gilles redesigned them.

I have the old Gilles adjusters on my 14 but I left the stock adjuster screws in to support the adjuster from the front and assist the back screw on the Gilles.

Gilles Tooling KTS Chain Adjuster Mod

Auron, This is a full shot on a new browser. + the photo so you can see the roller under the tooth. - the photo for another perspective looking at it. Now look at your photo, same area.

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn138/SheQeenTa/Flatpaintyell.jpg

Shoot that back wheel again, but show that last roller leaving the last tooth there at the bottom of the sprocket. How centered is your roller under that tooth U? Do U see where I'm seeing your roller no longer centered at the tooth? I'm over 7k and when I see you complain about the product and it's really the owner running too dry taking out product too soon for it's time.

You need to cry about nooks%cranny rim job cleanings and how do you explain you are not getting that poosea as wet as I have mine. That right there is the crime. 'The chain and sprocket has rights.' I'm just speaking on their defense/behalf [gone if not shot, shoot a pic].

Adjuster wise, the design goes both ways. Yes, more parts using the honda hangers, but the 14's a cleaner design. Both show how you address the axle moving forward. So the deal is, reverse the flats on the honda hangers? What is the difference in direction the hanger bolts go: left handed threads? Standard?

1. Yellow paint says: You have a flat for flat move until the book's 1.5 inches. Home the threads into the swing or home the hangers onto the back of the swing arm stops: that squares the axle = It can't move any farther and now paint a flat.

2. That chain has to be wet-wet-cry like a river wet you are all week at those nooks&cry all you want on someonelse is shoulderimshit. See me reach around for chain and sprockets? See the queefluff on the rims? Where is that dirty rim? Where is that soaked chain? Why if the bike is to eat off of, where is the wet chain fresh and ready to go? Looks very dry to me.

3. The permanent marker over the sprocket number is for what? To pick a link, mark that against the other magic marker stab on that stamped number. Why? I time my link to tooth I keep one consistent pattern going. Why? I have no hi/low spots. I broke the chain in loose first. Then, I run it loose to the point of not missing shifts: only then I can tell the chain needs an adjustment. I have yet to move that position, look at my roller hanging in there under the hoop, meaning, [ centered ]: why move the chain?

Here's what a Honda adjuster looks like (Not my bike).

Looking how centered the roller is it leaves the sprocket helps me a ton. If it's centered then you're good to go as far as alignment correct?

As I mentioned it's user error on my part but I can't help but question this design.

* Last updated by: Auron on 8/11/2014 @ 7:12 AM *

That Honda sprocket is WORN...pointy teeth not so good roundeyeLOL!!!

If you plan on a long day in the saddle, bring chain lube with you.

Roller and chain sort of centers itself to the tooth U being that sloppy for this purpose, so it is not alignment per say of the roller to tooth. Alignment is if my adjuster has one or more flats past than the other side. That more or less is cocking the axle some. This is called misalignment when the axle is cocked in the swing arm, not the roller and hoop so much being out of line.

Roller and hoop show wear riding up the hoop, at the sides of the hoop and that is thrusting the tooth wide upon, horizontal push, accel, and lift. Add those 3 wear points, this tends to make the U wider and elongates the tooth hoop.

When the 2 pins [thru the link] curl around the sprocket, it wears the one pin side down inside that roller. The rollers move 1/2 past the tooth U, because that half pass wears, causes the chain to stretch. See how the pin could not keep the roller held steady in the center? The pin is sheered off on one side, but the drawing does not show that damage. If better lubed, the pin damage is minimal and no galling off the pins. This is how you want to keep the chain well lubed at those pins inside the roller.

So look at the roller in proportion to the pin's moving. So the roller is not centered over the pin but to the right/left are those 2 wear points on the crunch/gall/sheer happening on half the pin: as it rounds the smaller sprocket and etches maximum gall/sheer around the pin.

Align: is look down at the swing arm. || This means the rear axle is square to the swing arm axle. |\ This means the rear axle is misaligned with the swing arm's axle.

Lube points: are those roller pins needing a squeezing of grease into the roller; or a dipping of links into a heavy gear oil and let that soak. There is no way chain lube can move horizontally into the pins but a good soaking and then that's only half a level flowing in, no top half being lubed like a forced squeeze or a soaking submerged.

Pin gall: is how a chain stretches; where the most critical lube point is; why you measure the pin stretch sheering off using more links; why they say the weakest galling off the pin is the weakest link.

Tooth U: is still clay, dough, putty, moving molecules you can stretch is the metal not wearing but if you sit at a light, ride over a hump? That's the tire torque as it leaves and curls that tarmac up like a mountain, you ride over that hump. Same goes for that metal stretching out 3-ways is how that tooth looks.

So what kind of shitty design is that Honda came up with?

The pic reminds me very much of my old '84's chain adjuster. Never had any problems with it loosening, or axle shifting, etc.

Lube points: are those roller pins needing a squeezing of grease into the roller; or a dipping of links into a heavy gear oil and let that soak. There is no way chain lube can move horizontally into the pins but a good soaking and then that's only half a level flowing in, no top half being lubed like a forced squeeze or a soaking submerged.

I'm fairly surprised I'm the only person here that oils my chain. Well, not really because oiling might be a tad more old-school and a bit messier (overall not really but it might seem like it) The whole point of lubing the chain isn't coating the outside, it's getting lube past the o(x) rings inside the chain itself. Oil the chain warmed, chain cools, causes a vacuum pulling the oil in.

Can someone tell me WHY the x-rings are in there?WHERE they are in the link?And why?Can anyone tell me WHY using a chain oil that degrades x-rings is a BAD idea?Something like wd-40?And what happens when the x-rings degrade?

* Last updated by: Grn14 on 8/11/2014 @ 9:16 PM *

Can someone tell me WHY the x-rings are in there?

WHERE they are in the link?

Can anyone tell me WHY using a chain oil that degrades x-rings is a BAD idea?Something like wd-40?And what happens when the x-rings degrade?

My first chain on the 14 had little tiny strips of rubber sticking out from between the links. Also found them stuck to the rear wheel. Don't use WD-40 to clean. I don't know how bad it is to run a chain like my old one. The x-rings looked okay in the link I broke to remove the chain and I didn't see any that were totally gone. Still can't help to have the x-rings or y-rings or o-rings breaking down. Kerosene works good for cleaning. Chain wax seems to work good and I've used axle grease with no bad effects except it flings off. Haven't seen any black wiskers stickingout of the chain with those materials.

The intake bladders? How can I make my engine more quiet I pass a db meter.
The rings in the chain. How can I keep the noise down I ride past a db meter.
The pillow placed upon my gas sea us orifice and walk into a crowded room. How can I keep the ears from hearing that decibelly laugh, I keep walking out the room with that planted on my ass here me walk.

1. Ring at all = Noise.
2. Ring design = Friction fighter touch points.
3. Ring is not about to hold a torque/thrust over 100lbs/tq and it's going to keep that grease in; do I have a bridge to sell you. Isn't this the very first chain adjust is all that grease is pushed out and off that pin? I now adjust my chain it's metal to metal galling from here on out.

Here is where I take my shot glass, wd40, an oring and I will report the results of half the ring soaking in the wd, half in the air. I see growth/over expansion/hello?

* Last updated by: Hub on 8/12/2014 @ 1:58 AM *

T/Y all....

This is turning out to be a great thread. I'd like to add this very interesting thread from another site, about chain adjustment from a guy that really knows his stuff.

What do you guys make of this? I think it's proof my last bike would eat through chains because the adjuster sucks.

Your text to link here...

* Last updated by: Auron on 8/12/2014 @ 7:41 AM *