Am I really going to gain anything by removing the secondary 'flies from a 2010 model? I've read as many threads on the subject here as possible, and seen conflicting views. Can a few with '08 and up bikes who have done this mod comment on the difference, or lack thereof? Thanks in advance.

Don't take them out. Its not worth the effort to do it. I have a 2008 and I can't imagine why I'd want to take them out. There isn't a thing wrong with my bottom end torque or horsepower that needs fixing.

Some have pulled them on 2008+ bikes, they can comment on what it got them.

Pro-

Pull them. No doubt in my mind. I yanked them from my 2010 today and the difference was immediate and noticeable without question. On the same map the bike was a different animal.

Just my 2 cents.

-Red

Hey Red,

Always helps to hear from someone who has actually done a mod rather than speculation. If you scour all the 14-related forums, the concensous seems to be in favor of pulling them. Seems like when I've got it apart for the pipe install, may as well do it.

The secondary flies are worth pulling, but I would suggest simultaneously adding a Power Commander and new fuel map to make sure your air/fuel mixture is in the safe operating range.

New Power Commander V's are $300, used ones can be found around $200.

A local tuner can build you a custom fuel map for your bike for around $250 to $300.

This investment will give you the best throttle response, horsepower, torque, and mpg that you desire.

Have a Muzzy M14 pipe and PC coming. Starting w/the Muzzy map, as they sent it already, and it's flies in. Will be easy enough to change maps; ready to try different combinations as so many have, including jeffo's and a custom tune.

I hate to say this, but I don't believe the two that said it made a big difference.

That would mean it increases horsepower, which it doesn't.

Does it pick up a little faster off idle? No doubt, but compared to 2008+ models, how much faster?

Mine is so refined off idle I would never change it. I can do really low speed maneuvers just barely off idle (like 1200 rpm, or even less) and if I want to go, I just twist the grip and she leaps forward willingly. I need it do what so bad I'd risk voiding my warranty which is good until 2015? LOL

If someone can quantify the "improvement" that would be great, versus "I think its a big difference". Heh.

I had been curious about this myslef so last winter I had Brock E-mail me his own dyno results. If someone can tell me how to upload a JPG file I can post the Brocks dyno results with one of his exhausts, flies in vs flies out on a 2008 ZX14. If my memory serves me correctly there was a small bump in power between approx 5500-7500RPM.

* Last updated by: danfzx14 on 9/8/2011 @ 10:31 AM *

Maybe there is, but there is no reason for it to be so. The 2008+ secondaries are open by the time you get to 5500 anyway, so I don't see where it could increase horsepower.

EDIT: In fact, I bet the 2006-2007 secondaries were open by the time you hit 5500 rpm too.

* Last updated by: privateer on 9/8/2011 @ 1:06 PM *

Yank'em! Thank'em! Shesnot on my bike, no thank'em! Shesmmmmmmmm-oooooooooooth ear w/out! Said the Shehoseshesfat.

Hub is all for YOU yanking your flies. That should be good enough reason to do it.

Yes, I wrote that tongue in cheek. LOL

Privy-

I see what you are saying, and I resisted taking them from my 2010 for the same concern of voiding the warranty. By no means would I encourage anyone to move forward with a mod that they might regret, but let us be honest. Pulling the flies takes little to no time, no special tools, and nothing takes place that cannot be restored 100% to factory spec (Unless someone damages the actuator or strips out a screw).
What I experienced was improved throttle response. I rode the bike in the morning prior to pulling the flies and adding a TR006a. It was (To Me) non-impressive off idle and shallow until the higher part of the mid-range. I recognized a noticeable lag in throttle response. After the surgery....same map, and it was snapping immediately off idle and pulling like a race horse. Even in 98 degrees with high humidity.
Ever adjusted a race bike between qualifiers? No dyno available, just an adjustment made that resulted in quicker lap times? I would not expect this mod to do anything for overall HP, I was looking for an improvement at the throttle in the lower rpms. I guess one could contribute it to either the flies or perhaps the TRE, all I am saying is that it worked. A lot of folks rely on Brock, and Brock handed us the TRE that requires the flies to be removed because that is the set up that he has seen the most success with.

You don't have to believe....but some faith would be nice.

Take care-

Red

My throttle sync is goes something like this. I've run stock with a few open screws, a few closed at the air screws. It was stock out of the crate, so I set the shaft only; first time. I've ran with closed air screws, sunk the shafts. I've run half turn of a screw out w/shaft sync. I now run 1 full turn open w/sync @ 15:1 AFR~cruise mode. No matter using sub-system or not.

My own hack goes like this. I got stuck in a situation the other day, the sub was so upset about that hack, it would flutter that fly, where if I had no [fly] hack attack at that certain rpm, not a thing would happen. I attribute that to the proper book sync-wink-wink. She'super'sensitive.

In other words, there is no jump of faith. Faithe truth. Every subtle move to that bike, you get a reaction, jackson! Just put a rag, a paper towel, a box, a book, I don't care, look around, shove something in your mouth to force some obstruction in it. Now breath in, go head. Now pull it out, go take a breath. Fucking faithat! WOThe fuck is going on here?

You don't give credit to Brock and thatreshit. I was watching you'all wasting time on a limp, 'Weed take measures like a lid? A gram? An ounce? Thefuck!" We take measures to slow you the fuckdown! HO, HA! I take measures to stay stock so I see your pipe'da'piss'the'shitre out of the $50, ring my bell, blow you away with a stocker anyway! LOL!

Used'guys ain't even close yet.

You don't have to believe....but some faith would be nice

I believe you RED!

Red, I'll take real world experience over arrogant speculation anyday. If one takes the time to read the other ZX14 forums, many good reports on removing the flies from Gen II models.

Calling people liars and idiots from behind the safety of a keyboard is, at best, passive agressive. Thankfully, that kind of personality isn't representative here.

Thanks for your insight.

I really wish I could understand hubbish. I've been trying for months now and I just cant do it! I know there is a ton of information in his posts.

Loool I hear u buddy!

Also Ctrnhub, the man is a Genius, or insane, both are very similar - is that crazy bastard still here, man I loved trying to read his postings, it was like a drug free acid trip, man you cant pay for that stuff!!!

As a matter of fact, I think this was written yesterday as a title caught my eye. A guy from another site came back after a short stint away. Asked where everyone was? Then I came up. Hey, retsam, then the guy goes in the same breath...

Come on cntrhub, I love your posts but if youre trying to say the shipping lane tariff taxing bullshit was somehow related to Muslim's thats just not historically accurate.

and that post made way to much sense for you, drop some more cid man, youre slippin!!

I then read that, made comment to someone else, to counter his argument... I now sent the HUBackup mode back in. He then retorted:

Today 4:51 PM... There we go!!!! Thats more like it!!

[Insert 3 laughing faces smilies, then continue...]

youre still the man cntrhub dont you ever fucking change !!

I'm not making thishit up. Notice how I'm toning it down so you are not left out, retsam.

Yank'Em. Your wrist should be in control of the air into your bike, not the ECU. Air when U want it.

including jeffo's and a custom tune.

Why, Dog has posted a great map for Free. Stand up guy, try it.

Why, Dog has posted a great map for Free. Stand up guy, try it.

I'm running the 2006 muzzy 10 that he gave us and it's better than the first generic map brock gave me. I have yet to compare it to the other maps brock sent.

* Last updated by: dragking on 9/21/2011 @ 8:31 PM *

I want to make it clear, in the case that it wasn't, that my post above was NOT in reference to HUB.

Romans, can you post a link to dog's map?

Romans, can you post a link to dog's map?

I will look Now cheers.

Free Map Click

Thanks, Romans..Drat.. PCV file, and I've got a PCIII