Hello all... New to the board but I have gotten lots of great info and tips regarding my 07 Ninja, so thanks for that. But now I have an issue thats really killing my brain. First, here is a list of mods. ATRE, muzzy timing wheel, speedo-healer, velocity stack (mid-range), PCIII, custom tuned by AF1 racing (New Braunfels, TX), Full Tsukigi cannon exhaust, +2 rear; -1 front. Stock suspension (both height and length).
Friday night did some drag racing and prepped by putting about 2 gallons of VP C-16 in the tank with about 1 gallon of 93. Very typical being doing this for months never an issue (well have noticed that the last few times I rode the bike would idle very low (under 1000) and in some cases turn off). At the end of a very succesful night of spanking busa's and GSXR's, pulled into the local Shell to gas up (Fuel level was at 1 bar). turned off bike, put in exactly 2 gallons. Then tried to start bike and it simply wouldnt start. No electrical issues, bike turned over fine, but wouldn't fire. finally when the battery was almost dead it started and the nastiest black and blue smoke exited the pipe. it ran like crap while banging, stuttering and not able to pass 6000 RPM with out stalling. Idled fine, and pulled decent from 1000-5000 but then would stutter, putter, and shutter. Saturday morning it started but when open the throttle in neutral it would rev to 3000 and stall and die. Changed the plugs, and now it WONT start at all!!!!!

Oh, and i did check the the muzzy wheel and its exactly where it should be....

OK, I'm a forum "squid".... Bout 4000 miles and the flies are removed, and BMC......

1. Who's spark plugs?
2. Charge the battery!
3. You are not going to like the rest;
4. Go right back to stock. First, replace the timing wheel.
5. No start? Keep it stock, next remove the xtre or whatever it is.
6. Did it start? What do you have next? Pull it off.
7. she running yet? Yank the PC off.
8. Oh, now it runs...

1-CHECK NGK CR9EI-A9
2-CHECK
3-WHY
4 thru 8 OH I SEE WHY.... DANGIT!!
9-THANKS A BUNCH FOR THE FEEDBACK!!

Star, Just a hunch on my part, but the last thing you installed was the advancer wheel, correct? You had all the other things on and it ran. First thing is switch the tone wheel. You might say you are 4° advanced but without a timing light kind of guessing there, guy.

So, tone wheel says it starts back up on the OEM. I could be wrong, but I'm just working your work backwards.

Actually all the mods listed were completed in one weekend about 4 months (1000 miles) ago. The following week it was tuned. She never showed any signs of any problems until Friday when she just wouldnt start then eventually started, but ran like crap and now a no start.

Yes, I was aware of said mods [were] all up and running. But we now have way too many variables that tie in with bulletproof. We have to start somewhere. If the PC has a fuse built in, pull the ("HOT") side [of each unit]. Ground still acts as a loop remember, and if hot senses ground, it still is a resistance, you pull a ground off one of the piggy units or aftermarket units.

Same 'ol story about you keep the hot side on, the injectors have a ground and your hot still being connected, you think by pulling the aftermarket's ground off, just think about that injector being grounded still to fire a trim. Just think about that speed sensor needing a ground. Just think about that gear position sensor that has a loop to ground.

We are both staring at a boat anchor. Ain'that a bitch! One reason you are handcuffed without points and carb to keep it running forever.

First, here is a list of mods.

1. ATRE: Has nothing to do with the ignition loop.
2. muzzy timing wheel: Has plenty to do with ignition or boat anchoring.
3. speedo-healer: Has nothing to do with the ignition loop.
4. velocity stack (mid-range): Has nothing to do with the ignition loop.
5. PCIII: Has plenty if not the puff out the back... What stock bike bellows out the carbon? A bad factory map?
6. custom tuned by AF1 racing (New Braunfels, TX): Again, bulletproof starts every time on a factory map is ask yourself that.
7. Full Tsukigi cannon exhaust: Has nothing to do with the ignition loop.

Maybe that kind of narrowed it down for you.

* Last updated by: Hub on 8/8/2011 @ 11:01 AM *

Thanks again for the awesome feedback. I will use this information to start the hunt. I really appreciate it.

Yeah, well, you have guys at the edge of their seat wondering what it finally was. I'm going to stick my foot in mouth and say it is 99% not the bike. It's that 1% chance we'll never know. Keep them guessing! Have fun!

He pulls one wire it starts right up.

Forgot to flip the engine kill? JK (no really, check that. I did that a couple times almost had heart attacks)

Nice looking 14 you have there.

Yo Rook....you too?

Ok Gents:
I started with the easiest plug first. So I unplugged the PCIII from the harness, plugged the ECU back and guess what,,,,, it started right up!!! Great!! so must be a bad map or even a bad PC, right? So I happen to have another brand new in the box PC.. Awessome, right? NO! So plug in the new PC with the same custom map. No fire, no sputter nothing.. So then I change the map to the one I used prior to the custom tune. Same thing, no fire, no sputter nothing... So, I unplugged the "new" PC, plugged the ECU back and guess what,,, started right up!! I even relocated the ground wire for the PC to a different spot thinking maybe its a bad ground. Nope! SO,,,, bike runs, but will not run with a PC connected and the mapping has no effect when the PC is connected. Is she allergic to PC's? FEEDBACK PLEASE!!!

So plug in the new PC with the same custom map. No fire, no sputter nothing.. So then I change the map to the one I used prior to the custom tune. Same thing, no fire, no sputter nothing...

1. Connector not connected.
2. Wire out of connector.
3. Wire ground slash unit is internally short to ground or broken wire inside no joy.

We know if bulletproof starts, it has no ground [problems] at the wires. That eliminates 1 and 2. Would you agree? But if we install that PC, it acts like variable 1, being in the reverse. The connector (PC) is connected that creates a short, no start. See that opposite as if you disconnect number 1 from itself like bulletproof would not work or code something at the injector.

We circle right back to number 3 being, you install the PC, it shorts to ground. WATT you did not do was to replace the PC wire harness. That would be the fast and dirty. But if you lifted a leg from each injector, might one find a direct short at a wire, harness, pinched, rubbed to ground sort of one variable is that PC wire harness having an allergic reaction to ground is my guess.

* Last updated by: Hub on 8/12/2011 @ 3:34 PM *

Okay....you say no fire,nuthin.With the new PC and the Old PC.How about the front of the PC(where the buttons are at)...are you getting the led bars to light up and go from bottom to top and back as it powers up(on the left led 'graph')?Key 'on',no starter press.You should.If you're not....wiring is definitely suspect...wherever the short is.The unit should go through it's cycle.It's either NOT connecting to the main power source,or something along those lines.How about the 9 volt battery hookup?Put that PC in the circuit again and hook up your 9 volt also(must be NEW 9 volt...not used).Now turn the ignition on.What happens?Don't forget to ground the PC.Unlikely 2 PC's would NOT be powering up(if they aren't).VERY unlikely.Key 'on'....led will sweep.But only once.It doesn't keep doing it.Everytime you key on,it will.

Okay...I read your post again there..."I changed the map"....HOW did you do that.Will the PC activate OFF the bike?(Both PC'S?)

The only way to change a map is with the unit fully energized in the circuit...that is...either USB connected to the Computer and also the 9 volt battery,OR,using the bike's battery as the power source,and the USB connected to your computer.NO OTHER WAY.Thinking you loaded a map in a dead unit....it won't do anything.If it wasn't powered up,you didn't get a map to load.

Simple check.If the units will powerup from the 9 volt outside of the bike....main harness disconnected,then the PC's are fine.IF the bike only starts with the factory plug from it's main harness and plugging into the factory plug, working fine,then you know the PC harness plug is a problem.That's it.That's what you would look at...the wiring plug(on the PC's).Or like Hub said...the PC harness going into the PC right there.BUT 2 being defective?IDK.I doubt it.And you say it DID run fine for a while...so......You MAY have a LOOSE pin inside the factory Harness Plug,where the PC is connecting.I'd definitely look close at that,make sure all the prongs are okay and secure.Didn't try to pull em apart by the wiring did ya?

* Last updated by: blue07 on 8/12/2011 @ 8:18 PM *

I tell ya this I was running a crappy map I got off the DJ web site .I wanted something closer to what my bike has in mods .I went with a Ivans map that I was Gifted (go figure), the map was for the tre ,stock filter,slipons.
I have flies pulled. I was told that the map was the BOMB but it is the BALM no power from idle then surge to full power. Yesterday i was doing some 5-60 rollons, the thing would just die when I pulled in the clutch at the end of the run lol. I think that maybe like mine, you may have a map that is not quite right for start and idle.
I guess sence most dyno jobs are done with the bike rolling and the map that are produced are for the same you are left with a hick up at start/idle that may be ok then get messy at some point I just changed maps back to one I had before and no death at the end of the run . so goes the same old story ...THE PC and ME

* Last updated by: xxxses on 8/13/2011 @ 11:27 AM *

Because I am handcuffed with the maPC I download, I have a morning map that may have been written over rich start, instead of zero me out, notouch me bottom 1,200rpm some. So, yes, I can see a fat map running well in a hot mode, but to write a fat number(s) "over the morning map" like it ran hot on the dyno, let's pull out all the stops... Yes, I can see she is hard starting needing more air or a more opened throttle angle just to match that AFR.

You mean those rat runs you download are tuned hot, forget the morning map is hot syrup coming? How do you take your cough fee is glad you didn't buy that map is crap is... Oh, now rank on Ivan's map; the bar to jump. Wait for 1bad. There is some announcement he's got.

@blue07--"Okay....you say no fire,nuthin.With the new PC and the Old PC.How about the front of the PC(where the buttons are at)...are you getting the led bars to light up and go from bottom to top and back as it powers up(on the left led 'graph')?Key 'on',no starter press"
*Yes,, The PC cycles through and the green light goes from top to bottom when the key is turned on. Then, once it cycles, the light goes off until you press the start(ignition) button. Is the green LED supposed to stay on when the bike is not running and only the ignition on? I was told that it is not....

@blue07--"The only way to change a map is with the unit fully energized in the circuit...that is...either USB connected to the Computer and also the 9 volt battery,OR,using the bike's battery as the power source,and the USB connected to your computer.NO OTHER WAY"
*Yes,, I changed between maps by plugging in a 9 volt battery to power the unit up. After "sending" each map, I received the "map sent successfully" message.

I even drain the tank to make sure I didn't have any bad "gas" that mabye the ECU could compensate for (and start the engine) and the PC couldn't/wouldn't...
Good thought on the pins in the connectors.. I checked them and made sure all were present and tight. Also, if it was an issue with a pin, would it have the same effect when connected in the factory location?
What about the ECU? Could there be an issue with it that will not allow it to "read" the PC?

I know its been a while since my last post... Well here is my story and I'm sticking to it... Gremlins!!! I plugged everything back in, used the same map, same PC, same ATRE, and it started right up and runs like a champ. I did trim the rubber boot from around the ground wire clamp to give it more contact area. Although, I did check the ground from the PC earlier, I did come down hard a couple of times during the night of racing from wheelies. I believe the ground wire from the PC may have gotten loose. That in conjunction with the rubber boot "sorta" interfering may have caused the problem. Either way,,, I appreciate all your guys help and I posted a few pics on the photo thread.. Check it out.. Thanks a bunch.

Thanks for the update LoneStar! Either that or some corrosion worked loose from unplugging/plugging. Glad it's straightened out.