Hi Guys
My question is, when flat out at top speed can you hold the throttle full and the ecu will limit the rpm or are you best to manually sit just under the limiter rpm (if it has one in top gear top speed)?

I have had many fast bikes but all analogue with no computers, at top speed you had to watch your rpm and adjust the throttle position as to not blow the engine.

Many thanks Maddy :-)

Try this: go out and try to redline your bike in 5th gear.

If you can do that without chickening out then we'll talk about how to manage 6th gear at max RPM.

Regardless of what throttle position you are at (100%, 95%, 90%, even 25) or what your wheel speed is, the rev limiter will come on at 11,000 rpm causing a pulsating ignition cut. DADADADADADADADA!!!....you know. KPH and TP don't matter at all for the rev limiter, just the engine rpm which the ECU is monitoring constantly incase you redline. Yes, you can control the rev limiter with the throttle so the engine does not hit 11k rpm. But it is pretty hard to do that in the lower gears where the engine speed increases very rapidly. Normally you would just shift up a gear if you hit the limiter and now your engine speed has backed down 500-700 rpm.

The Top Speed Limiter works the same way except it is triggered by wheel speed. Hit 300 kph and there will be an ignition cut that will prevent the engine from making enough power to exceed that speed. In addition, the ECU puts the bike in limp mode which further reduces the power and there is no way you will reach 300 kph again until you clear the limp mode. Stop the bike, turn the key off and turn it back on, limp mode is clear.

SO to answer your question, you would need to position the throttle to avoid activating the TSL. The ECU will slow you down to 300 kph but it will also put you in limp mode which will slow you down even more.

I'm pretty sure a flash will disable the TSL so you can hold the throttle wide open over 300 kph. The old school way of doing it was to set a speedo corrector so that the speedo would never hit 300 kph. Then you go as fast you want without activating the TSL. I have a hunch that will not work on the Gen2 because of the more advanced electronics.

I would want to make sure there is no chance the TSL will kick in. That's gotta be scary at top speed not to mention it puts the fun to a screeching halt immediately.

* Last updated by: Rook on 2/4/2019 @ 9:27 AM *

Maddy, To answer your question , I held my throttle wide open for about 15 seconds in the following video of a 5th gear top speed run at Mojave Mole in 2016.. It was my initial LSR event and after qualifying at increasing speed, getting my license to run wide open, I was so excited that I forgot to shift to 6th so you can see what happens once bike is topped out..It is actually pretty gentle reduction reduction in rpms . At 3:30 , you can see that it is "bouncing" off teh limiter Speed was 192.8.
Mojave Mile 2016 Rookie year
MY bike is a 2013 ZX1441 R with Schnitz flash and Yoshimura RS77 full exhaust system

* Last updated by: chrly on 2/2/2019 @ 4:45 PM *

hagrid , dont be a dag lol

Im considering the salt flats land speed record for a stock bike.

And you know my history, I ride like a girl, so try and keep up ;-)

I used to wind my old 2001 zx9r out to 300 on the track, the speed doesn't bother me.
Its the sudden stop that sends me to hospital lol.

Maddy, you need to check the rules for " stock " . some organizations require no electronics change and you would need to return to stock windscreen, I think..Diff orgs , different rules . Are you talking about running Bonneville?

Just for kicks, here is a run at Colorado which worked out to equal about 8000 ft of elevation higher than Mojave so I ran same speed in 6th gear as I did at Mojaves' lower elevation , in 5th gear.. You can also tell how much you are getting hit by wind , seeing the difference in camera mount. Mojave was mounted to the bars and Colorado was on hte side of my helmet. We had about 10 mph side wind at Colorado and it feels pretty violent at times.. well at least it did for me LOL

Colorado Mile 2018

My first two events at Mojave were cut short due to motorcycle accidents .. Both had to do with riders seemingly never letting off after going thru the traps. first rider was hospitalized with many many broken bones with about a year for any decent recovery. the second rider never survived , after going thru the traps at 207 mph..This is fairly serious stuff so find some successful participants and question them thoroughly . The majority 99% are really really good people and will go out of their way to help somone with parts , knowledge, or whatever :)

Thank you Rook
It would be tragic to drive 22 hours to chase a land speed record and have the bikes computer shut me down.
I will ask the guy that did my woolwich dyno if that is still in the system or not.

What I was wondering before you educated me about things i never knew existed was would it be faster to sit just under the limiter at 10k rpm than have the motor bouncing around at 11k rpm.

I have to put the stock mufflers back on if im to attempt this class, I will do some flow metering on them compared to my stubby ones.
I am allowed to change the gearing and have to reach 350kph or 217.48mph.
Every thing must look stock, ride height etc.

Any advice is very welcomed,

Thank you lots Rook x

Chrly
Maddy, you need to check the rules for " stock " . some organizations require no electronics change and you would need to return to stock windscreen, I think..Diff orgs , different rules . Are you talking about running Bonneville?

Hi Chrly
Im in Australia and we run at Lake Gairdner in South Australia.
I wouldnt need to change the bubble (windscreen) as its a genuine Kawasaki touring bubble for that bike but I was thinking to maybe go back to stock for aerodynamics, the wind tunnel will tell. The speed limiter can be disabled and the ecu retuned for Aust record attempts but stock mufflers, air box etc.

Thanks lots :-)

Chrly
Maddy, here is a video of a 5th gear top speed run at Mojave Mole in 2016..

That seems very smooth, any frame or suspension mods ?
I seen it appeared like you had 1/3 of a tank of petrol, how was that for weight?

I will have to remove my handbag box from the rear of my bike, lol.

Oh Chrly
Were you running stock gearing ?
Thanks Maddy

From what I have found, talking to the other 14 runners at three different LSR events that I have attended is that the stock gives best results. Sounds as tho you are doing your homework :) and Good Luck !! It is an interesting experience for sure.. I am headed to Texas in March to make one more attempt at 200 mph.. Goona be a crowd as they have almost 250 entries...for a three day event.

* Last updated by: chrly on 2/2/2019 @ 4:50 PM *

Hi Chrly
From what I have found, talking to the other 14 runners at three different LSR events that I have attended is that the stock gives best results.

It looks like yours is a drag race type thing (without the burnout)

At the salt lake we get a 2 mile run up, then we are timed for 2 miles then have a 2 mile slow down and have to do the same the other way.

You were well in 5th able to change into 6th at about 2 miles , that gives me an idea on gearing, maybe I could drop a tooth on the rear.

Thanks loads, you have given me some great info.

Yes , I was running 17/42 , stock .. I have my bike lowered 1 7/8 inches front and rear..Tires at 42 pounds and suspension set on the stiff side..I weigh about 139 pounds suited up , presently. Stock susepnsion components except for Brocks lowering links.
All weight reduction helps obviously so you are correct, I had a bit less than 1/3 of a tank so did it help? It all helps ;)
I believe my bike sits at 560 pounds with a full tank . I am still trying to find a scale that is closer in tolerance so I can pin it down to within a pound or so.
I have noticed that most of teh bikes also run the pillion cover , sure would be nice to have a wind tunnel to play with as I hear so many variations on aerodynamics.. I have two inches taken from my stock seat so I sit pretty low, but am ondering if that creates a worse airflow than teh stock seat or use the pillion cover or.. This stuff will keep you awake at nite !1 LOl and yeah ditch the handbag carrier LOL

Have the limiter raised Maddy.Then no worries.Yer not gonna blow the motor up.swswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswswsw.lol.gotta love my kitty.she's just learning to use the keyboard;)

Have the limiter raised Maddy. Then no worries. Yer not gonna blow the motor up.

The bike has only 30'000 kilometres on it or 18642 miles, I would like to try flat out before it gets lose.

Thanks Grn, Hello to kitty, they love to help ;-)

I weigh about 139 pounds suited up

Chrly , you are lighter than me, omg ! Im 154lbs or 70 kg but im not telling you whether thats suited up or not lol. I'll have to diet ;-)

Maddy, I have two daughters grown up that do not speak of my weight so I understand..;)

I would want to make sure there is no chance the TSL will kick in. That's gotta be scary at top speed not to mention it puts the fun to a screeching halt immediately.

Hi Rook, Its had a woolich tune ( if i spelled that correctly ) He said but I will double check, Top speed limiter disabled amongst explaining launch and buggered if I know what a 2 step clutch thing is with the tune.

Thanks, heaps for taking time to reply

And that goes for every one.

Wait a sec ... Are you saying a stock bike went 217.48mph?

I didn't think any stock bikes would do that.

* Last updated by: extrapolator on 2/3/2019 @ 8:09 AM *

"Wait a sec ... Are you saying a stock bike went 217.48mph?

I didn't think any stock bikes would do that."

From what I could see, the 217mph record was for Modified Partial Streamling ...It appears that the Stock record for the 1650 class is a 2012 Kaw at 208.153

Ralph Nichosl

* Last updated by: chrly on 2/3/2019 @ 10:26 AM *

Hi Rook, Its had a woolich tune ( if i spelled that correctly ) He said but I will double check, Top speed limiter disabled amongst explaining launch and buggered if I know what a 2 step clutch thing is with the tune.

The 2 step clutch is a rev limiter for drag launching. The ECU has been programmed to limit rpm while the clutch lever is pulled. You should be able to hold the throttle wide open with the clutch lever pulled and the engine will only rev as high as the value that was flashed, say 6000 rpm. An ignition cut comes on at 6000 rpm and the rpm cannot go any higher than 6000 until the clutch lever is fully released. This way, as you slip the clutch, your rpm cannot go high enough to induce an out of control wheelie. Once the clutch lever is fully released, the launch rev limiter is disabled and now you can go to the normal rev limiter at 11,000 rpm (unless they flashed that to a higher value like 11500 which they probably did). I think we talked about this last summer. The rpm for your two step is a very individual thing based on your launching skill and how your bike is set up. Try opening the throttle as quick as you can with the clutch pulled. You should hear the DADADADADADA come on below the normal 11000 rpm rev limit.

* Last updated by: Rook on 2/3/2019 @ 2:10 PM *

Have the limiter raised Maddy.Then no worries.Yer not gonna blow the motor

I do not think it would be possible to hit the stock rev limiter running in 6th gear. You could hit the top speed limiter which would do the same thing + put you in limp mode. If the TSL is disabled, you don't need to worry about hitting the rev limiter in 6th gear (at least not on the Gen1 and I would almost bet the same is true for the Gen2).

If you have shorter gearing, you might be able to hit the 11,000 rev limiter in 6th gear before you even encounter the TSL. I put a 45 T sprocket on mine up from a 41T. Looks like I will hit 11,000 rpm at about 190.

With your TSL disabled and your rev limit raised to 11,500 rpm, I do not think you could go fast enough with stock gearing to hit the rev limiter.

Wow Chrly, it does not look too bad at all to hit the TSL....and still you went faster?...and the rpm went higher?

* Last updated by: Rook on 2/3/2019 @ 2:31 PM *

a different look.Listen for the limiter hit.

* Last updated by: chrly on 2/4/2019 @ 8:38 AM *