Decisions decisions ... I say fuck it, do all three.

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Decisions decisions ... I say fuck it, do all three.

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Turbines frighten me a lil' due to the odd lean condition.

Nitrous Oxide frightens me A LOT due to the frequent lean conditions.

Increasing displacement... from where I sit that introduces the least amount of question marks.

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Geez wolf I haven't a clue which is best, I would probably go with Carpenter racing. But what do I know.. I'm still running a gen one. I have spent my money on ohlins suspension, and some Brembo stuff, I'm more of a twisties guy so more horsepower would be fun but good suspension and brakes has saved my ass on numerous occasions. I'm looking forward to seeing how your build plays out. Whatever you decide will be awesome for sure, win win. You Canadians are definitely speed freaks.

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Some real world experiences with a couple of my previous bikes:
40,000 miles in 4 years on my intercooled, turbocharged pump gas Honda Blackbird with no engine failures of any kind. It was my daily rider. 255HP and 155 lbs tq...torque is what gives that arm stretching acceleration.
I rode the bike from northern NJ down to Asheville NC a couple times and spent a week playing in the twisties. Then rode home. It ran cooler than stock with lowered compression and got the same fuel mileage. A turbo brings new meaning to the words "throttle control" when in the twisties and changes the time-distance relationship we've gotten comfortable with on stock or semi stock bikes. Stock brakes become inadequate, stock suspension barely acceptable.
As far as stronger internals..not necessary until you get greedy with boost and/or have a poor tune up. I set my bike up at 11.5 to 11.8 AFR at 10 to 12 lbs. I might have given up a little HP but at that level, who cares. Turbo motors are actually a bit easier on rods and pistons as the compressed air in the cylinder provides a cushioning effect. Pistons are usually the first parts to go, usually from heat. Once you buy the good parts, the only limit is size of the turbo and quality of the fuel.
I also had an intercooled turbocharged Suzuki Bandit. HP, TQ, boost level, fuel as follows:
pump gas...235 HP, 135 lbs tq, 12 lbs
av gas.....255 HP, 155 lbs tq, 15 lbs
VP C-16.......287 HP, 185 lbs tq, 18-19 lbs
A direct comparison was my NA 1340cc Suzuki Bandit. The head, block, pistons, everything came from Bob Carpenter of Carpenter Race Engines. It made 195 HP and 108 lbs tq on Powermist TQ 137 but was built to run on pump gas.
It made 185 HP and 105 lbs tq on pump. It had the best internals I could buy. A NA hot rod is a high strung, hot running, maintenance intensive beast. I had it and one of my turbo Bandits at the same time, a draw through with water injection, made right at 200 HP. I almost always rode the turbo. I sold the NA motor to a guy from Texas who put it in a Bandit set up for the 1/4 mile. He ran 9.1 and 153 by the 12th run on the combo...life went backwards for him and he liquidated it but it had 8.8 or 8.9 @ 155 in it.
Anyhow, I'll readily admit I have no experience with a modified ZX-14 but the outcome remains a constant.
The turbo is easier to live with on a daily basis, makes more torque by far, runs on pump gas and is a blast to ride but requires an experienced rider to get the most out of it.
I'll pass on NO....no experience nor do I want to be tethered to the mothership. Take a NO bike on a 2000 mile, week long ride and see how far the first fill will get you...then, you're SOL...
Decide how you want to use the bike and choose the mods accordingly.
Hank

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interesting solution to bottle mounting for rider 2. Good to know you can turn the bottle around on the bracket like that. Think of how tucked away and compact that would be if you removed the bracket and turned it 180° then bolted it to the tail frame. tail subframe removed to open up space and the bracket emerges from the undertail right where the subframe was. The bottle would ride right below the tail pod. That's how I plan to set up my nitrous system. ...until I graduate to a 5 lb bottle under the seat cowl!

* Last updated by: Rook on 12/29/2014 @ 10:19 PM *

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Rook you are one smart dude! When this, NOS goes in I've got to phone you. You doing a progressive controller or you letting it all ride on Black?
W

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Fox,
True riders are the ones that exploit a motorcycles real attributes. I am a real fan of riding hard through corners and wasting rear tires. I'd love to address my front suspension. Love the gen 1 by the way. Throw up a pic soon man!
W

* Last updated by: Wolfman on 12/29/2014 @ 11:30 PM *

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You doing a progressive controller or you letting it all ride on Black?

Right now I plan to install the NOS and just use it very carefully. No zipping through the gears on spray, probably just hit the button for a few seconds after a shift is completed and after I visually verify that I'm in the right rpm window to do it safely. I plan to start out with my smallest nozzles and tune it myself on the road. LOL I will be so careful, I'm sure I will do a quarter mile faster without NOS. When I feel like I'm ready to go for all it's worth, I'll get the progressive controller and whatever other electronic backups I need in case I slip up.

The real danger as I recall is missing a shift on spray. The engine won't like that, WOT freespin on boost. Also as someone mentioned, bottle temp. I believe you can get a bigger shot of nitrous than you tuned for from a bottle if it gets hot. Cold is the usual problem. I'm pretty sure the bottle cools off rapidly while spraying which causes the pressure to decrease. I don't know how much of a problem the bottle temperature issue will be. There are a lot of cool digital gauges you can get to monitor all that stuff from the cockpit.

There are a lot of NOS questions that I haven't even thought of yet, I'm sure. All I know is that it's been done safely, it's cool and I like it! ....and as I mentioned, my bike is 7 years old! but still too much money in mods to blow it up. I guess I could always get a new motor if I do. It wouldn't be as bad as crashing.

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Wolfman, I have the same two people inside me...lol
My buddies rent Jennings Motorsport Park for a private track day once a year,
They asked me why I didn't ride the turbo. My answer:
"Because I run out of equipment, talent, and common sense all at the same time...:)"
After a blistering ride across PA RT 84 which had the front wheel skimming across the pavement, prior to shifting to 6th at 185, I sat back and realized I needed to calm it down a bit. At my age and with my personal parts replacement history, I was asking for trouble. I don't bounce well and I don't heal like I used to. Time to sell the turbo stuff and slow the hell down. That's when I bought my bagger, a ZX-14 with Givi's...:)
Richard at RCC, a neighbor of your's I'd guess, is the best turbo guy around. He's spent years perfecting his kits and I would do business with him in a heartbeat if I wanted to scratch the old itch again.
Get in touch if you have any questions.
Enjoy and ride safe.
Hank

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A couple of my buddies here have Richard on Speed Dial. I have watched some fairly large bags of cash land in his lap. I've seen his work. He is very impressive. He has an eye for detail and does not strike me as all salesmen. I am afraid to call em, I am easily talked into parting with cash. I am very impressed with his work, some of his installs are beautiful.

I deal with a local guy down here. A gentlemen I've befriended. His names Mitch from Frankenstein. He does beautiful work, takes the time to swap war stories and reminds me of my best friend growing up Frank Macedo (also Portuguese and a wild man)! I would like to give him the opportunity to build a NOS kit or perhaps over see a BB build. My buddies up here are running Turbos that exceed 300 hp, so to eat these mates I'm going to need something big. Spending 10 plus is not in the cards, but if they keep thumping their chests(u know who you are) I will exhaust every resource to bring it.

For now I am very happy with my 14r as is, she is running a Cflash and I'm very happy with her. There is something very cool about NA bikes, just something I appreciate. The only TURBO I run right now is on my car, and I've managed to detonate it often.

I'm definitely going to give you a buzz.

Mad love
W

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PM sent

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PM returned..

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You know, Wolf, if I was you, I'd hop right on that turbo band wagon. Your buddies all went through the trial and error aspects of learning to do a proper turbo setup which will in turn result in you having a badass, yet very reliable, build......hmmmm....flawlessness.

* Last updated by: nasty on 12/30/2014 @ 8:08 AM *

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+1 nasty

And really... The most expensive part is the rebuild sandwich. Avoid that and you are golden. You know what the 14r will take.

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I am going to stop biting my finger nails soon! I have to get off this here pot!!!

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Wolf I say you throw a progressed 100 shot on, head to the track, learn how to apply that power, and then post the ticket for the chest thumpers. Then it's simple... Post a better ticket or sit down. I'm sure you will still get some of the "But.. but... but.. muh hawzpowerz... too muchzz powerz ta keep tha wheel down brahh.. have to roll-on race with tha ricerz...."

As always a brilliant assessment - tickets talk ballihoo walks. It be nice to own the street scene too.

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Race from a dig like men do. Case closed.

Ontarians dont post time slips... We post receipts.

Track times mean nothing to us. LOL

* Last updated by: Fazer on 12/30/2014 @ 10:39 AM *

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Or......,
Just be sure you have enough power to overcome any deficit in a botched launch.... lol
I gave a Gen 1 a 10 bike advantage on me and ran him down so bad he nearly shit his pants and fell off the bike.
I think I passed him as he was midpoint in 4th by atleast 50km/hr
ahhhh, that never gets old...

(name removed to protect the innocent) ran a gen 1 14 and never had a chance. You also chose a back road that went flat and straight for miles. I shall not make the same mistake my friend. Nor shall my bike be 200hp less than yours.

* Last updated by: Wolfman on 12/30/2014 @ 1:51 PM *

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You guys are rough on the zx10 guys. Hell if that bike is stock it only makes 150 HP.