The stock dyno curve correlates with my butt dyno. I don't feel that is so strong at 2000, but the dip is very noticeable between 2000 and about 3500. That's a lovely gain, very compelling.

The flies out mod must be folowed up with blocking of the kleen valve.

To stop/limit the popping on decel:

The kleen valve is the large grey hose leading into your airbox.
pull it out, plug it and put it back in.
It also helps to lower your idle back to stock settings.
And last but not least, you have to reset tps on your pc3.

Interesting discussion. I have an 08, and frankly in box-stock form didn't find it weak in any way. Having ridden Kawasaki bikes since the first model year of the H1 Mach III, I have something to compare it to. Spent 24 days with my ZX-11 (jetted, muzzy pipe, ohlins, etc. etc.) sport touring western Europe, and thought I had found the fastest sport tourer I'd ever ride. The 12 didn't appeal to me. The 14 did, but it took me 3 years to get around to it, hence, I have a 2008.

Compared to lighter bikes, sure, it seems a bit sluggish. Same goes for cars too. And boats. And planes.

What I really wanted to say, though, is I'm going out to Brock's Performance in August, and their recommendation for the 2008 ZX-14 is leave the flies in, put a GiPro/ATRE and PC3 on it with a full exhaust system (I'm going with black ceramic and 14" carbon fiber can 4-1).

If Brock says leave the flies in on the 2008, there is probably a good reason why a street-going 2008 doesn't need to have the flies pulled. No ?

After reading this and TRYING to understand any of it I have come to the conclusion I need to get rid of the 14. Seems other than turning the key I am professional stupid about this bike.
I do kinda like the way it runs.........after the key is on of course.

After reading this and TRYING to understand any of it I have come to the conclusion I need to get rid of the 14. Seems other than turning the key I am professional stupid about this bike.
I do kinda like the way it runs.........after the key is on of course

Thats the way to be with a bike, other than maybe being able to change the oil (not all that easy on the 14 compared to my 11 for example) and such. Most of these guys would enjoy riding their 14s a lot more if they just rode them and had fun and didn't worry about adding 2 hp anyway possible. :p

Take off the limiter and the stock 08 will break 200mph no problem. It sport tours very nice (not as comfy as my old 11, but then, not much is these days at this performance level) and it gets envious stares wherever it goes. Pretty good I think.

I'm still gonna let Brock do their magic on it this summer. But notice, I'm letting experts who earned their great reputation doing exactly this, and who are considered at the forefront of ZX-14 horsepower development (see their drag bike diaries, etc.), do the work. I don't need to understand much more than exactly what I want it to ride like. They can translate that into hardware.

When I get it back, it will go faster and handle better. Thats all I need to know. But the discussions here are still well worthwhile following. I have learned a whole lot about the 14 on the previous incarnation of this board, and it will continue here. I appreciate the knowledge and observations of folks who, unlike me, are really obsessed with modifying a perfectly good stock motorcycle. Heh.

Be forewarned that the Brocks exhaust are extremely loud (118db peak) unless you go with the gen 3 systems (hindle exhaust)but yes they do make good power.

Rusty ,I also hated the lack of low end torque(year 07)and the constant over reving of the motor to get the big girl rolling .Another thing that got on my nerves was the need to down shift when it was time to pass other cars when cruising at highway speeds .It seemed to me that the zx rpm was in a hole at 60mph (3250 rpm) . Now the mods start . And for me , the flies out were a must . After trying this,the hook was now in. Then the PC-3,BMC race ,slip on pipes ,then single pipe Gearing and a pro tune Map. I later installed the dynojet ING module(WOW) for timing advance and remaped both the fuel and ING curves . Bike now leaves the hole like it's ass is on fire .I now have my own ACME ROCKET . No need to gear down and no over reving when just driving slow .I find the bike now easier to ride . This bike does have serious bottom end balls ,she just needs to be uncorked. I do realize this is not for everyone but if you are not happy right NOW do not be discouraged like I was . It is easy to change . I am sure the guys here will walk you through it as they did me . My 2 cents . Cheers .

* Last updated by: Romans on 3/1/2009 @ 2:53 PM *

Well put.

I was so dissapointed with my '07 bikes low down grunt which was the main reason I bought it - I figured a 1400 would have loads of grunt. (I bought it to replace a ZX-9R because I was doing a fair bit of two-up and wanted to tour Europe with my partner on the back)

I did not want to fiddle with a brand new bike, had concerns about voiding warranty etc. but the alternative was to sell it as it was so bad I hated it, these things cost twice what they do in the states and selling one that is a week old would have cost me about $2500 dollars!

Within a week I had a Gi-Pro fitted, this is a TRE plus gear indicator, this made the bike rideable and made it feel on par with my old ZX9-R, but stil a way of what a 1400 should feel like, certainly far less grunt than the old 1100's (I used to haveone of them too) and WAY off my mates early type Busa.

I would recommend a TRE to anyone who is nervous of pulling flies or wants a mod that is easy to take off (like when t goes to the shop for servicing), also there is a new one coming out from Healtech called a X-TRE, this intercepts the signals so the ECU can run an unrestricted map, but still allows the dash Gear Indicator to work.

Anyway I still wanted more, so bought a PC3 and pulled the flies - WOW, proper grunt now, just like a 1400 should be and just a few hundred dollars.

How many people spend thousands on exhausts, filters, ignition modules etc. to get a 5-15% power gain in the 8-11k region, when for a fraction of that cost you can get a 50% increase in the part of the rev range you use most, for BHP per dollar the flies out mod is the best by a mile for early bikes.

The other thing is most '06 - '07 models wil be out of warranty already, and by the end of the year they all will be, so no worries about warranty anymore.

If you like the low down restriction that is fair enough, but you may as well downgrade to a 600 and save a bucket load of cash!

would recommend a TRE to anyone who is nervous of pulling flies or wants a mod that is easy to take off (like when t goes to the shop for servicing), also there is a new one coming out from Healtech called a X-TRE, this intercepts the signals so the ECU can run an unrestricted map, but still allows the dash Gear Indicator to work.

Unless something changed in the last month, the X-TRE will still not be available for the ZX-14. HealTech was unable to adequately reverse-engineer the ECU inputs/outputs to make it work. Works on Suzuki and ZX-10 motorcycles, though.

hoopie: Be forewarned that the Brocks exhaust are extremely loud (118db peak) unless you go with the gen 3 systems (hindle exhaust)but yes they do make good power.

Ya, the alien head and smeg are way too loud for me. Going with the 14" carbon fiber cannister, basically a short version of the 20" carbon fiber gen3 cannister. Just a little louder than the 20", but not enough to matter.

Any idea what db the 20" gen 3 produces? I like the thought of the ceramic coating (heat reduction) and the 20" (hopefully quiet [ < 100db ] ) coupled with the flies out, PCIII and an ignition module (+MFC hub) so I can change the ignition timing in first gear at low rpm.

By all accounts, this should be quiet, smooth, cool, and haul ass from idle and breath well until redline.

I might even stop whinging by then!

Amen to Minerman1. 07-pull flies,pcIII Race Version,bmc filter,4 degree advance trigger,STOCK PIPES,16/42(or 43)gearing.She aint gonna BOG.You won't be stayin at 1000 rpms fer longLOL!!

Any idea what db the 20" gen 3 produces? I like the thought of the ceramic coating (heat reduction) and the 20" (hopefully quiet [ < 100db ] ) coupled with the flies out, PCIII and an ignition module (+MFC hub) so I can change the ignition timing in first gear at low rpm.

Actually, I thought Brock's Performance had a video with sound, but it might not be on the site anymore. Could look on Youtube, I know smegs and alien heads have shown up there as "zx14 exhaust" before. I doubt its all that much louder than stock.

I'm glad I've got an 08 if only because I don't have to pull the secondary butterflies. Besides, the Gipro-ATRE combined with the PC3 (or 5 if Brock's can make it work) will be more than adequate for an 08.

I'm hoping the black ceramic exhaust system will do as you say, but in any case, I like the look.

My buddy has an Alien head on his Busa-Way TOO LOUD IMO.Aint no stealth ridin when I'm with him!!

Very sorry but I just can't understand this guys lingo. Needs to learn some english or something.

"Thank you Hub.YW

1st hand experience, just what I was looking for. Now, the next questions for you are:

1. What other changes did you observe when you did this change? I hear anecdotes like popping on decel. Decel is a given. When I rolled off, made that left, followed a car, said there is the pop? I added that second pipe= All stock with that minor left exhaust a touch open but my cats do not leave the building. Say the center cat was not there like it made a difference, remember I ran a few errands with that single pipe gave me less pop but it was there still. I wanna conclude I had less pop being what would be filled [on coast mind you] is a single pipe full of unspents not shared with the second stock pipe to lean me out.

I would have to re-install to a single pipe, hook a camera audio to the rear end, slow-mo maybe both single and dual, listen to both sounds off the left pipe and hear/feel the gargle loading the hacked pipe does to mid-cabling. You know that "mid" where the throttle is mid between throttling and not throttling = Mid Throttling?

Yeah, you should hear that puppy do the, 'mouth wash gargle.' And note for note she loads up (coded now being I have the '06 t-body in backup) all stock like piggyless/codes turned off, "Looking for Linear" sounding. I'm clicking your Youtube exhaust notes, [not yours of course, russty, is just say inn. Someone had the camera out of bike's physical range and all you hear is exhaust first. I said, oh that is some nice sounding tone there and he pans the rear end now. What tone do you think still has that certain note? He now moves and I see a set of stockers. He's bone stock. I have no clue if that was stock or he had a piggy sitting jetted in idle, I have no clue? Sure, you can change to any after market, we are going to be about the same in popping or more, it plays leanskis on lift, so if you wanna hear reference, I added for you when I heard a pop. Usually it is your concern about popping and I ignore you thinking you can quiet that popping bubble changing to hearing it more in a more open note to the air. It is popping in the stock pipes with the same lift at the throttle. You just do not hear it as pronounced. You wanna go nuts hearing that pop or depop your squidcity stopit all ready with the pop of nature farting out de ass. Nature lets your ass lift and pop is same-same out day exhaust is lie about everyday you pop piss tune don't give me that shit."

voodoo,

What year bike is that dyno sheet about?

Jeesh, this debate is endless, I've been through all this 3 years ago and now we're back to square one.... again! Kawasaki, if you are listening, get a clue..... stop the insanity and de-restrict the low end on the 14....completely!!!! Fer cryin out loud, how many people have to tell you guys when they buy a 1400 they want some low end balls not a pathetic 600 response?????? OK, rant off...the power is their folks, my '06 will smoke the tires right off idle, arm straightening torque....more than I could ever need, which is to say....just enough! In most situations I use very little throttle leaving the line to prevent wheelspin. If you want low end grunt on the '06/'07 snatch the flies out and make a set of dog tags out of em. Add PCIII, get Ivan's flies out/slipons map and add a set of slipons or leave stock exhaust on there. You heard me right, the slipons give much better off idle response than a 4-2-1 system. The stock system works even better down low but the slips give you +10 HP at around 6000 and maybe one or two on top. The 4-2-1 will give more topend power but ask yourself, how often do you need to wind a 1400 up to 11,000 rpm on the street??? Icing on teh cake, add the +4 degree timing advancer, added benefit she runs cooler. '08 is going to be similar, they're almost the same machine but remember Brock is a drag racer......not a street rider. He will tell you this, just call him and ask him. His stuff is optimized to give the lowest possible ET on a drag strip not the smoothest riding experience on the street, he doesn't even like to ride on the street. Go back and read his ZX-14 Chronicles from 2006 for his philosophy. There is a huge difference when these things are tuned for every day riding...i.e. low end response. Call Ivan at Ivan's Performance and see what he's got cooking for the '08. He is a street tuner not a drag racer, do the whole package and you won't be sorry, just ask BadinBlack. He took my advice and you couldn't wipe the grin off his face.

Kruz

* Last updated by: Kruz on 6/17/2009 @ 7:31 AM *

I was hoping for the magic 08 map from Ivan a year ago. All he needed was someone to loan their 08 ZX-14 to him in NY so he could tune it for them. Then legacy would have lived on. I don't know how he got no takers. The answer would be to switch to an 06-07 ECU. I have no idea what that would cost and I wouldn't bother with it yet. Maybe in a few years if the issue hasn't been cleared up though some more practicle means. I really don't have a problem with the stock bottom end power at all, it's just the little jump I feel at 3K that I'd like to get rid of and if that includes a bit more power off of idle, I'll take it.

Ivan was great for you G1 guys, but I've started looking to other options (heck, there are enough G1 owners who don't run Ivan's map). I'm starting with a PCV and autotune and when the Liquid crystal display unit becomes available for that I'll try adjusting the map even more myself. From there, I might try a custom tune if it seems like a professional could get it done a noticable amount better. Currently there is only 1 dual full system for the 14 (Brock's, ~$2000!!!! )and we G2s need the full system if we want to eliminate the cat in the collector as well as the 2 in the cans. I'm planning on going with a full system single pipe but I might change back to duals at some point if it seems like the bottom end suffered too much.

IF ANYONE HAS A USED TSUKIGI CANNON FOR SALE LET ME KNOW. SEE MY TOPIC IN FOR SALE/TRADE.

Rook

I can only speak for my 06 14.......but I also own a busa, which are pretty much acknowleged as the king of inline-4 low end torque machines. With JUST the flies out and a pc with Ivans map and tre, my 14 had MORE low end than my busa....substantially more My 14 was truly monstrous down low for an inline-4, no bull. The 08/09's are diff beasts tuning wise, so I don't know firsthand how they would respond to flies out tho.
And if you want the maximum low end torque, keep the stock dual headers and add slip-ons. A 4-1 or 4-2-1 exhaust will take some low end away but give more peak power
Just read Kruzsters post....and he's right, he was the driving force behind my flies out/Ivans transformation....and it was truly a beautiful thing. I STILL can't wipe the grin off my face lol. I just hope the turbo install doesn't hurt the low end any (fingers crossed).

* Last updated by: BadinBlack on 6/17/2009 @ 3:09 PM *

Badinblack, low end response is going to be the least of your worries on that monster... hangin onto it will be your biggest concern I'm thinkin. Remember though, once you go turbo they say you can never go back...spoiled fer life.....that's why I'm stayin away.

Kruz

* Last updated by: Kruz on 6/17/2009 @ 3:28 PM *

I kinda felt the same way when I got my 06', great top end rush, but for 83 cubic inches it felt like a 500 under 5K - probably the lawyers - but with flies out, -006 TRE, Ivans map, area P slipons, and a PCIII all is forgiven! in fact, 1st gear now must be used with caution (just the way it should be ) to prevent wheel spin and/or wheelies - 2nd gear too.. all is now right with the world. By the way the milage at 80 mph is now 46.8, much better than stock.
This is how this bike should come stock, but the lawyers would wet them selfs - weeenies..

that's why I'm stayin away.

Kruz, all we need is a test drive. That turbo hook might pass us by

Just read Kruzsters post....and he's right, he was the driving force behind my flies out/Ivans transformation....and it was truly a beautiful thing. I STILL can't wipe the grin off my face lol. I just hope the turbo install doesn't hurt the low end any (fingers crossed).

Ivan also has a new map in 2009 for the 06/07 guys. You gotta love a pro tuner who rides a zx-14 and has it parked next to his dyno. I guess the long winter did have some benefits.

Ivans site says that you must purchase a $200 minimum to get his maps. What's up with that?

Romans wrote:
Kruz, all we need is a test drive. That turbo hook might pass us by
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dream on lol............a turbo bike is like sex or great food, one ride and its the kinda thing NOBODY can pass by
Believe me, I've been trying to shake the addiction for years now.......but every road led back to TURBO-TIME!!
Its kinda funny actually, the select few who rode my last turbo bike all have turbo's now....turbo cars, turbo bikes lol.
Hey Kruzster........your destiny's waiting

* Last updated by: BadinBlack on 6/18/2009 @ 3:55 AM *