No ported {bored}throttle bodies?Hmmm seems like a different opinion coming from a respected tuner.From respected people I have been told a throttle bore can net 5 hp on the 14s without, porting the head ,cams or stacks,apparently she can benifit from just TB bore,Hub where are you?

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178 HP, 100 TQ in 80 degrees weather at about 712 feet above see level

Pretty darn nice DK! I didn't know that there was such a reputable tuner so close to home. When I get back in June, I will be checking him out for sure to "Cheese" my ride! Looking forwards to reading about the rest of your build up!

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dragking that's some good info about the v-stacks, I always wanted to know it they made a difference. Also when I was stationed at Ft Hood 05-06 I owned a 04 Hayabusa and my barber another busa rider uses Johnny Cheese to work and tune he's race bike. Man I miss track days at Little River!

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From respected people I have been told a throttle bore can net 5 hp on the 14s without, porting the head ,cams or stacks,apparently she can benifit from just TB bore,Hub where are you?

I heard the same but the way it was explained to me, it made sense. Plus even at Bikeland where 99% of the crowd is in the go fast business, it's rare to see a 14 with just that mod! We need to check with Somefun. I think he's got the mod and hopefully some dyno numbers.

Looking forwards to reading about the rest of your build up

Forget about reading about it! If/when you come down, we will hit a nice lunch spot and take all the fun detours. The restaurant is right on one of the fun roads in Austin, I'll let you take the Black Mamba for a spin. Lunch on me
Give a call to Mr. Cheese, he's going on vaca in June for a couple of weeks but just set up something with him and let me know a couple of weeks in advance. I will probably do another run to see if there is consistency.

dragking that's some good info about the v-stacks, I always wanted to know it they made a difference.

A lot of guys swear by them but unless I can pick a set for $100, I'm not willing to find out. If they move the power a little, then it's normal to feel something seat of the pants wise but dyno and trap speed haven't been conclusive.

* Last updated by: dragking on 5/5/2013 @ 5:16 PM *

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I have heard the V stacks move the power also. That is why they have the longs and the shorts. One is tro move the power up and the other to move it down. No extra hp.

Seems i have heard about the 47mm t-bodies not amounting to a whole lot also.

Modding is pretty simple: If you have money to spend, buy what gets talked about on these forums. The more obscure mods aren't worth testing out. The bike has been out a long time and what works is pretty much known.

PC
Brocks pipe (and couple others highly recommended)
Pull flies on a 06-07
Loose as much weight off the bike as you can.
Suspension upgrades

Drag I think your bike is the poster child for performance mods that are proven to work. Only thing is I can see a few pounds you could loose just looking at your defaired pics.

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It's like this dar, you go to a local boxing ring, you can't walk in there and think it's a tapping/slapping contest. You are there to learn a skill and work at it, all exercised out and in contention shape. Same thing as entering a JonnyCheeze Chop. He's not going to grind your wallet, it's the same walk thru the door, you are going to get the massaging the bike needs to run up front, give [it back to] the top dogs that keep taking trophy or going home with your purse. It simply takes money to make money. And any edge of HP gain is the name of the game.

So with the injector duty cycle being you can flood the plugs wet, so can you bore the tb's and match that mod. The mod is bore me, whore me out, port my walls, bigger injectors, ti bolts for strength and lightness, lighter wheels, ti exhaust for more hp, 4 individual 02's and tune each one, mortgage the house and kids.

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I have heard the V stacks move the power also. That is why they have the longs and the shorts. One is tro move the power up and the other to move it down. No extra hp.

All depends how you look at it. Que, if I took 4hp and 2 torque from middle of your bike that you were not using and moved it up top where it can be used when banging through the gears = Good mod ?

The tuner sounds like he is nice enough to explain more could also be gained with the cams set up to match. To most not worth it.

4 individual 02's and tune each one,

I've always wanted to do this. On the dyno o2 sensor up each pipe for the custom tune $$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Drag any chance he has tested coils on our bikes, or busa ? Would love to here straight talk on this one. Rags reporting big gains,,,,,

* Last updated by: Romans on 5/6/2013 @ 4:47 AM *

Think of stacks and pipes and porting as a speed event. Who is out the pipe faster? An open pipe or a muffler'd pipe? The air channel is like a mouse in a maze is the muffler trying to reach the [cheese] end. Drop a ball down a straight tube. Who moved faster [out the end] is all about HP. The grunt happens with a lot of clogging. You lose something somewhere when you mod so this time, the open pipe shows no mercy to grunt and steals it all for the top end before you feel something happen.

The stack length is like a shot glass and a tall glass. Begin from the top of the liquid [air], open the trap door. Which air moved to the [top] of the stack faster to fill the [volume] of air into the chamber faster? The shorter stack. Because if this was water at the same level [just under the shorter stack], the vacuum draw would lift the liquid up and into the shorter stack, whereas the liquid would have to climb up higher to the longer stack and take more time. The grunt comes from a longer stack time. The top end comes from the shorter stack event 'moving faster.'

The head will always make HP. The crank can only move 360° and the cam can only lift so many inches(mm) before it bangs parts. What is left is the head design. The curve continually is removed as the valve begins to become more of a straight shot into the chamber. The curve takes time to move around that bend and then speed up again. This [porting thing] is like like waxing a table. With the dust cloth, you send the rag flying and it stops short. So you polish the table with a wax. Same as smoothing the port walls so the air takes less drag licking the sides of the wall. Now, that rag flies over the table all waxed and ported [polished] smooth is that finished port matching flow for flow.

The factory matched ports in the 12-13R's. They suggest you do not mess with the porting. Your bike, your call.

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Drag any chance he has tested coils on our bikes, or busa ? Would love to here straight talk on this one. Rags reporting big gains,,,,,

I can ask him next time I see him but it wasn't mentioned. What I like about the guy is that he's a straight shooter. He told me for touring, sport riding and the occasional track days the bike was fine but that if I wanted more power...trade it in for the 14R and work from there. I saw a 209hp chart he had for a 14R and if you want more power get a Busa and get in the motor. They are easier to work with and more reliable.

That's a 600 hp Busa in the background! At this point 1-2 hp is irrelevant. That's why: you want power, get a good pipe, you want more get a Turbo, the rest is just if's and maybe's.
You may as well try these Romans

Manufacturers claim up to 2-3hp on top on big cc bikes
I feel like the bike runs a little smoother and gas mileage improved a little bit. Old plugs were only 200 miles old but it could have been a coil not being push down all the way in, or tightening tq on the plugs. Who knows?
All I know is if you take 1-2 hp for the BST's, 1-2 for the plugs, 1-2 for oil and petron additive, you still looking at 172-175 HP on a generic map!

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@Romans: You and Hub would definitely kick it with Cheese, as long as Hub leaves the dildo home! LOL

* Last updated by: dragking on 5/6/2013 @ 3:35 PM *

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I was talking to Lang Hindle this weekend , throttle body bore out not worth it, without headwork cams etc.Hub heres a memory for youS motor

* Last updated by: darryle on 5/6/2013 @ 7:43 PM *

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CheezeIS, drag,

Net wise, I think Cheese and I go back about 2006 is it? It was when I was trying to figure out more about the tre thing. Cheese was doing his homework with the gear position sensor, but a locked 6 was all about being book savvy. Anyone that would ask about the tre on the busa it was always, "don't do it" from Cheese. But my guess was, he could not explain the why either. Looking back, he was right.

While I was barking out page 3-43 'backup' your ass was bent over for a limp mode, NOLTT was coined. Ass the years went buy, I kept on laughing, mule'inn, laughing, remule'inn up with another try at it. All the while I'm flashing, laughing, school'inn my ass off, laughing, cursing now.

Handcuffing my toaster like that. Either toggled on the fly, including with and without fly bye wire. And then Cody the Hacker Jacker Offer kept on beating you over the head with it. Sort of dickslapping the wattage whacking jacking off your wallets.

It'sooooooooooo Funny! 2 Dis Day! WATThe Fuck!!?!? No, it is watt it is. Me and fill in the blank ---- are still laughing it up.

Signed,

NOLTT

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@Romans: You and Hub would definitely kick it with Cheese, as long as Hub leaves the dildo home! LOL

ROFL, that's for sure. What if Hub hits me with it ? Ya the dildo thing to risky, makes for a wild video lol.

Hub heres a memory for you

Another one. This one ran in the 8's on the week end.

I have heard the V stacks move the power also. That is why they have the longs and the shorts. One is tro move the power up and the other to move it down. No extra hp.
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All depends how you look at it. Que, if I took 4hp and 2 torque from middle of your bike that you were not using and moved it up top where it can be used when banging through the gears = Good mod ?

If it works that way, I'd say yeah. If the peak hp/tq remains the same but the curve simply becomes more top end oriented....eh, I might try other stuff first. It's interesting and easy to reverse but may be $300 out the window.

I was talking to Lang Hindle this weekend , throttle body bore out not worth it, without headwork cams etc.

So how much are we talking for the whole package? Any guess? 47mm Tbodies is $600....head? ....cams? ....etc?

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Forget about reading about it! If/when you come down, we will hit a nice lunch spot and take all the fun detours. The restaurant is right on one of the fun roads in Austin, I'll let you take the Black Mamba for a spin. Lunch on me

COOL! I will definitely take you up on that if I can get something set up with Cheese! Definitely the free lunch run! Black Mamba? Nice name...

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Dar, That put us on the same page as Lang. It's not worth a mm if you are not going to match the hogging out one throttle body, one port hole, one valve growing in mm too, the ex valve is opened in proportion. If it's not wearing a number plate, you'll piss money away and never feel its real potential being in the salt or on some mile course.

You can't run a cam'd bike without it being a light switch kind of ride. It's no longer linear. It's built for one reason. So you eliminate the cam and you pissed what you started out with and it's not manageable on the street... Without teething problems with too much aftermrket and their hours of replacing or bang goes the head. Where you going with this, Rook?

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So how much are we talking for the whole package? Any guess? 47mm Tbodies is $600....head? ....cams? ....etc?

PM Somefun! I just checked his signature and he's got all those mods. 206 hp at the rear wheel! That being said, from what I understood , Tq is more important than HP on our big heavy bikes. Plus not only that, you have to factor aerodynamics. What was Somefun number last year? 183-190 MPH (strong winds), while his buddy Busa beat him by a couple of MPH! Somefun's is lighter and has more power but looks like the falcon pierce the air better. An S'Tho with 193 hp and 85 tq should have more top end speed than a 14 with the same HP and let's say 100 tq. Look at the power the new 14R is making with a reflash. I think I was down 20 ft-lb at around 8k rpm and the bike had 209 hp so theoretically that bike should reach 200mph. With the work you mentioned, you get big hp numbers but if you can get 120 ft-lb IMHO 200MPH will still be a pipe dream (pun intended) unless you weight like 150 with you gear and wet. I have said it before, all Kawasaki did was, build a bike that makes a little more than a well set up ZX-14, then the left the door open with the reflash to make it a Hayabusa killer. Honestly is stock form, I'm still not impress with the 14R. 190 hp with a safety mod and heavy but buy it, transfer your old pipe, cough up $400 and you're making above 200 hp. Pretty tempting if you have 15k (9k if you're trading in) laying around. On the other hand Suzuki knows that the true hardcore Busa fans get turbos. So if they build a 14R Killer it would just be for a new market. Not enough incentive for a company that is having issue balancing the checkbook.
Brock's was able to do it with a light jockey on the 06 14 and that was without a reflash but I think he used race gas, o w oil, BST wheels, bike was stripped down to bare minimum and map was probably tweaked on site etc... so it's doable just not worth the $$ and hustle in my opinion.
When I send my ECU in, I will probably get some O W oil, and another bottle of Petron Additive. I'm tempted to get a map made with those and race gas just in case I come up short for a top speed event. I will try to get that done in October, then register for the Texas Mile and maybe LSR in Spring
As always, I'll keep you guys posted.

COOL! I will definitely take you up on that if I can get something set up with Cheese! Definitely the free lunch run! Black Mamba? Nice name...

You won't be disappointed!
She used to go by Eloisa but with numbers like that I had to switch to

If she can break the 180 hp mark she gets the R LOL

* Last updated by: dragking on 5/7/2013 @ 10:45 AM *

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If she can break the 180 hp mark she gets the R

That's the ticket! As always - living vicariously thru you guys as to what mods I make! At least - until I return from Afghanistan for good and can do this thing all the time!

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Looking forward to have you back in the great state of TX BWillie!

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Looking forward to have you back in the great state of TX BWillie!

Thanks man - me too! This thing is getting old!

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